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[Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.6

 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:58 pm 
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OracleBoyd wrote:
I read your last battle report and I think Khorne especially benefits from being mono-faction. The Initiative and especially the Stategy rating are extremely important for them getting close.

The other benefit Khorne has is cheap(er) activation counts. Khorne can have 4 Support formations for 900 points, Undivided/Slaanesh 1050 and Nurgle/Tzeentch 1100. That's at least a 3rd Scorpion or 7-8 demons and quite possibly an extra activation (fighters).


Yeah, Khorne has some advantages, but since their primary strenght is close combat (which can be very tricky to use, and against Skimmers even impossible) I think they're always going to be inherently weak for that reason. I agree that they really benefit from the extra strategy and the better initiative when engaging.

Thinking of two improvements they might get: One is +5 cm move for the Khorne Chaos Knights, and perhaps it being easier to summon Fleshhounds too.


Last edited by Mrdiealot on Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.4
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:04 pm 
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OracleBoyd wrote:
Mrdiealot wrote:
Went out and bought a box of Necron Wraiths, and built three Greater Brass Scorpions out of them + some Chaos bitz. The way I did it was by turning them upside down and using the claws as legs. They're a tad on the big side, but totally works.


Those look great.

How big did they end up being?

I'm considering these...

for about the same price.


Here's a size comparison from the latest battlereport. That Dropzone model looks like it could work very well indeed, and for significantly less effort in conversion. Thanks for the tip!


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:30 pm 
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A picture of my Chaos Knight conversions of the Onslaught Miniatures Knights, specifically the Khorne Mauler and the Tzeentch Weirder. The conversion is simply buying one of each of Onslaught's Knight types, and swapping one weapon from one arm to another.

Next picture is some Knights I've made from Forge World Servitors, will probably use these for the Undivided and the Nurgle Knights.


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.4
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 10:45 pm 
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Mrdiealot wrote:
OracleBoyd wrote:
Mrdiealot wrote:
Went out and bought a box of Necron Wraiths, and built three Greater Brass Scorpions out of them + some Chaos bitz. The way I did it was by turning them upside down and using the claws as legs. They're a tad on the big side, but totally works.


Those look great.

How big did they end up being?

I'm considering these...

for about the same price.


Here's a size comparison from the latest battlereport. That Dropzone model looks like it could work very well indeed, and for significantly less effort in conversion. Thanks for the tip!


Probably about the same size then. The Dropzone ones are listed as 50mm.

Still probably a bit large for 3DC, but not too bad. It evidently comes with an additional gun option as well, which might be chopped up and mounted up front to represent the Demolisher cannon.

edit - I also noticed a typo.

Chaos Warlord titans may exchange one or more non-close combat Battle weapons for a single Support weapon.

The red text should probably be deleted as it's slightly confusing. I'm assuming "Eye of the Gods" would allow a Warlord to take a second Support Weapon, correct?


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:29 pm 
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Yeah, that was a typo. Thanks for spotting it. And Eye of the Gods can only be taken by Chaos Reavers! This is to differentiate Chaos Warlords from the Chaos Emperor titan.


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:58 pm 
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Mrdiealot wrote:
Yeah, that was a typo. Thanks for spotting it. And Eye of the Gods can only be taken by Chaos Reavers! This is to differentiate Chaos Warlords from the Chaos Emperor titan.


Ah ha,

If only I could actually read. I knew there was a reason I hadn't tried to do that in my earlier list.

Is there a thematic reason for the Reaver being the only one that can get Leader?


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 5:29 pm 
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OracleBoyd wrote:
Mrdiealot wrote:
Yeah, that was a typo. Thanks for spotting it. And Eye of the Gods can only be taken by Chaos Reavers! This is to differentiate Chaos Warlords from the Chaos Emperor titan.


Ah ha,

If only I could actually read. I knew there was a reason I hadn't tried to do that in my earlier list.

Is there a thematic reason for the Reaver being the only one that can get Leader?


Well, the Supreme Commander ability includes Leader too. Thematically I guess it's about the list consisting of dead, possessed hulks of metal stomping around. Not much leadership going on!


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.41
PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:02 pm 
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Also, Chaos Undivided Titans can of course take the Command Head, which also gives leader.


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:25 pm 
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Post updated to 1.42


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:05 pm 
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I've just had a quick look at the list out of curiosoty, but how come there's every other combination of god and titan time except no Khorne Warhounds? That's clearly an omission that needs fixing!

The Black Library / HH background has a dedicated Khorne leaning titan legion - the Legio Audax. Their Warhounds in particular have their own specialised tactics and harpoon weapon the 'Ursus Claw', which they use in concert to tackle bigger foes as below (the quality of the artwork isn't amazing but it's official GW art from a BL novel):

Image
This is a fan conversion to give you an idea:
Image


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:45 pm 
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I wasn't aware of that bit of fluff, really interesting stuff.

That being said, I'm a bit hesitant to give Khorne access to Warhounds as this would mess up the current balance in the list. Their access to Lords of Battles and Greater Brass Scorpions means that they have stuff that other powers don't, and that needs to be balanced somehow.

But you're definitely right in that it is an omission, and the harpoons look neat. I'll think about it!

Edit: If anyone has a good idea for what rules one would give to the harpoons I'm all ears. Preferrably something where you don't have to invent a rule for them.


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:53 am 
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Here is the original flavor text for them:

Harpoon Missile - A Harpoon Missile is actually a jury-rigged weapon, cobbled together from a device that allows the Mechanicus to override a Titan's MIU in the case a Princeps fails at controlling it. The mechanism inside the Harpoon will override the rebellious Machine Spirit, forcing it to shut down or to obey the Harpoon operator's commands. During the Horus Heresy, this system was turned into a missile weapon in a desperate effort to bring rebellious Titans under control without having to destroy the priceless machines. However, the Harpoon Missile's efficiency was low at best, and the weapon became completely ineffective once the Titan had been altered by Chaos or possessed by a daemon. Today, this weapon is never fielded, and is only kept in reserve in case one of the Titan Legion's machines dominates its Princeps and runs amok.

The old Titan Legion rules were basically a 1-shot weapon that destroys any 1 non-Titan model when it hits or destroys 1 Void Shield/Power Field. If it hits then roll a D6 - 1=falls out, 2-6 Take Control of Titan for the Turn.

Let's not do that!


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:56 am 
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No! You're confusing two different things.

Legio Audax Ursus Claws aren't the old style Harpoon missiles which were one shot cyber-hack missiles with the ridiculous effect of taking over the enemy titan. The Ursus Claws are much more simple physical harpoons like those used by old whalers and which remain physically attached to the Warhound by a cable, allowing then to close with and pull over an enemy titan. Read the background I linked to above google them.

If you feel they need a downside compared to other gods as khorne had one of no Warhounds in place of other toys, how about making the Khorne Warhounds only available in pairs? Their background talks about them tactical style of hunting in packs. It'd give the option of fielding them but with more limited tactical flexibility.


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:43 am 
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Having Khorne Warhounds in "pairs only" is a good idea. In addition, I think I'll add that they can't take duplicates of the same weapon.

My current idea for the Ursus Claw is: Range: (15cm) Firepower: Small Arms Notes: Extra Attack +1, Titan Killer D3. Feral Warhounds only.

So with this the basic tactic is to try and engage some War Engine, hope they blow away any shields with their normal firefight attacks, and then hope they hit with their Ursus Claws on a 5+.


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 Post subject: Re: [Developmental] Traitor Titan Legions (TTL) 1.42
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:40 pm 
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Sounds like reasonable stats to start testing them to me.


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