Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

Super-heavy Tanks

 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:31 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
The only problem Koshi is that the stormblade has been re-imagined in its current guise, without most of the other gubbins.... check out the pdf here (http://taccmd.tacticalwargames.net/view ... 74&t=19885) for the rules

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:33 am 
Purestrain
Purestrain
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:16 pm
Posts: 4682
Location: Wheaton, IL
I believe the current fluff says the missiles were taken out of service due to the rather annoying tendancy to explode on the rack.

*edit* - There it is: IA1, p99. "After three Stormblades from the Phyressian 31st Heavy Tank Company were destroyed by their own missiles, the Hellion racks were deemed to dangerous and taken out of service."

_________________
SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:06 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:39 pm
Posts: 292
Location: Mooskirchen, Austria
Kyuss, I know the pdfs, thx.
Spectar, I also own IA1. But there is a forgeworld, which still produces the old variant. :D So maybe it will be rare, so max. one company.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:57 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:32 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Detroit Rock City
+1 to having rules included in the interest of WYSIWYG and likewise having just gotten a hold of a company. Certainly rules could be added to allow either the lascannons and heavy bolters or the missile racks, with appropriate points differences?


Last edited by austinitor on Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:24 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:32 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Detroit Rock City
Thinking about this and looking at the model and the related range (especially the Plasma Blastgun on the mkI, which is only about half the width of those on the mkII), here are some thoughts.

As to main armament:

I think that the mkI Stormblade should carry a Plasma Destroyer like the Leman Russ Executioner variant, (and co-axial one-shot missile) and leave the mkII as-equipped. That said, the gun on the mkII appears larger than that of the mkI Warhound Plasma Blastgun, so perhaps some alteration to the mkII is in order.

Alternately, we could consider the mkI to carry a Plasma Blastgun, along with the co-axial missile, and that the mkII should carry a Plasma Cannon (3xMW, +15CM range). The entry should be "Plasma Blastgun and Hellstrike Missile OR Plasma Cannon". In both cases, there should be a cost increase. The Plasma Cannon is a 25 point upcharge on the proposed AMTL lists (over the tier one Battle Titan weapons; the Plasma Blastgun is in a tier below those as a Scout Titan weapon, and should probably be considered cheaper still). Perhaps the upcharge on the unit (with either configuration) should be something like 25 points (since this is a "tier 2" battle titan weapon, and the AMTL lists seem to value scout titan and tier 1 battle titan weapons equally)?

Of these two options, I think I prefer seeing the mkI with a Plasma Destroyer because a) it gives it longer range vs. the Plasma Blastgun, which makes sense given that the mkI has a long, slender barrel, and b) because it leaves the mkII alone (which I think comes from Imperial Armor), and requires few changes across the list.

Onto the missiles: I'd also propose we keep from creating new rules (at least, new to this edition of Epic) for weapons, and instead go with some others that are already in the Imperial arsenal. Likewise, I think these weapons should be vehicle-grade, not titan grade. It probably doesn't make sense for a superheavy tank to carry a comparable weapons load out to a scout titan (i.e. more than one titan-grade weapon). It should, instead, carry either about one titan slot's worth, plus 1 tank's worth of capability, or 2-4 tanks/transports worth of capability; look to the Shadowsword and Stormlord as precedent in the former case, and the Baneblade and Stormsword in the latter case.

On the co-axial missile (known as the Hellion in Epic 0-2ed), we could say it is a Hellstrike, like what is carried by the Vulture, and use those rules (i.e. eliminating the TK aspect). This helps avoid creating additional/special rules and instead just alters the loadout slightly, plus, it also gives us some cost-basis for it in already play-tested rules. Otherwise, we end up with a tank that's carrying a mini-Deathstrike, which seems unlikely to be balanced without a significant cost jump.

As for the Hellfire rack, let's re-consider it a Hunter-Killer rack. That said, multi-shot Hunter-killers are categorically better than a lascannon (range, firepower, etc), so there should be a cost bump, there. Compare, for instance, the Space Marine Hunter and the Predator Annihilator. They are the same cost, but the PA is carrying 4 total lascannons (two combined in the turret for AT4+, the others in sponsons at AT5+), while the Hunter carries unlimited-shot Hunter-Killers (AT4+/AA4+). Following the cost-basis for those tanks, I think this should be a 20 point upgrade.

As for the battle cannon, the barrel is simply way too short, and it ought to be instead stat'd as a Demolisher or "Snub (Nosed) Battle Cannon". In either case, this is vastly superior to a lascannon and should cost more, as well.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:39 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2004 6:42 pm
Posts: 3305
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
I believe that Plasma Cannon is being phased out- the current FW IA books refer only to Plasma Blastgun and Plasma Destructor for Titans. The AMTL lists are moving the same way. Thus would make sense for the Stormblade to stick to PBG.

I am happy enough with the Hellstrike Missile being 1-shot- replaces sponson lacannon- would be happy with small points increase if necessary to balance.

Cheers

James


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:53 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:32 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Detroit Rock City
James: interesting note on the Destructor. Phasing out though it may be, is anything ever, really? They've also just introduced "throwback" Land Raiders and Predators, one variant of which matches the mkII Land Raiders from one of the Epic editions (perhaps some of the white metal models from the Space Marine era)?

Re: replacing the sponson, it is the rack of 4 smaller missiles that seem to replace it. There is a also a bigger missile mounted co-axially on top of the Blastgun.

Likewise, the other sponson is replaced by a larger-than-las-cannon of some variety. I think it was indeed a battlecannon under Space Marine and perhaps Epic 40k.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:07 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2004 6:42 pm
Posts: 3305
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
No not Plasma Destructor- they are phasing out Plasma Cannon- the middle one of the 3 Titan plasma weapons. Sorry if I was unclear.

Re missiles- sorry was forgetting details of old model- the large co-axial missile definitely would have to be one-shot.

Re other sponson- is it noticeably different than lascannon? Given that EA tends to the middle ground between detail of SM2 and the over-simplification of E40k. Look at the way many similar Ork and Chaos vehicles have been grouped together.

Where possible for Stormblade Mk1 we should stick to existing EA weapons unless absolutely necessary. Let's not overcomplicate things. Small differences in weapon looks and sizes can be put down to the different Forgeworlds thatmanufactured them, as each Forgeworld would use mainly locally sourced materials. Hence the cosmetic changes between Forgeworld models for Arkurion, Lucius and Mars patterns with no actual changes of stats.

Cheers

James


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:04 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:32 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Detroit Rock City
@James: ah, I didn't know about the phase-out; thanks for the information.

No worries.

Yes, it is indeed noticeably larger, with regard to the diameter of the barrel.

I certainly do grasp the "this pattern/Forgeworld differs" bit. In this case, though, the plasma weapon is radically different in design; it is a long, slender barrel, where the current model is broad (based seemingly on 2nd ed 40k and later plasma designs) and looks comparatively "double-barreled" or "twin-linked", as it has two muzzle protrusions in the front (sort of like stormbolter; a double-plasma combiweapon, a veritable "stormplasma").


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:05 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:52 am
Posts: 3078
Location: Bristol, UK
there are suggested stats for the mk1 stormblade in the collectors section of the softback EA rule book.there a little bent for 200pts though!

_________________
MoK's Painting Blog
Now Showing:
Mok's Modular Modern Messy Guard Army


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:08 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:32 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Detroit Rock City
@Man of kent: interesting! Did these make it into the PDF versions?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 3:03 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:39 pm
Posts: 292
Location: Mooskirchen, Austria
Man of kent wrote:
there are suggested stats for the mk1 stormblade in the collectors section of the softback EA rule book.there a little bent for 200pts though!


Hmm, as austinitor asked where they anywhere available?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Sper-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 3:22 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2004 6:42 pm
Posts: 3305
Location: West Yorkshire, UK
Collectors models section was one of the PDF's of EA Rulebook on GW website

_________________
My TOEG- Blood Angels and Deathbolts
My Painting Blog- Evil Sunz, Goffs
My Epic trades list


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Super-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:08 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:39 pm
Posts: 292
Location: Mooskirchen, Austria
Hmm, ok an in witch pdf? I don't found it in the Rulebook sections.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Super-heavy Tanks
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:38 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:39 pm
Posts: 1974
Location: South Yorkshire
The collectors model section and designer notes section were never put online.
You'd have to get a copy of the rulebook unless someone has made their own pdf and can put it online.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net