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Siege Assault Vanguard

 Post subject: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:17 pm 
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Based on Forgeworld's Space Marine Siege Assault Vanguard Army in Imperial Armour 10 i came up with the following army list for Epic. Note that this is a Siege Space Marine army on the attack as opposed to the Imperial Fists army list which is based on a Siege Space Marine army on the defence.

Edit: V0.3 now available.


Attachments:
SiegeAssaultVangard0.3.pdf [87.04 KiB]
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Last edited by BlackLegion on Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 4:08 pm 
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Oops. Forgot to adjust the points cost for the bigger vehicle formations.
Correct version now in the first posting.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:25 pm 
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Ok 9 downloads and no comments?

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:08 pm 
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Quote:
Ok 9 downloads and no comments?


Looks fun, sort of list i could see myself using as the defensive IF list does not interest me so much. Comments on marine lists always seem to get very involved, so i was just going to passby in silence … :)

Having a lone caestus as formation and letting it carry tacticals seems a bit odd given that it can carry 4 and the formation is 6? NetEA seems to have experimental caestus at transport 2.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:34 pm 
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Yes. Ideally the Caestus would be an Armoured Venicle and/or Aircraft which could transport units not from it's own formation.
But as everyone seems to believe that independent transport vehicles are to complicated i put two Ceasti on the same base and call it a War Engine Aircraft with DC2.
I choosed 2 because 3 seemed even more far fetched.
This restricts the transportable formations in this list to the (standard) Assault Detachment and the Siege Terminator Detachment.
This makes the Caestus a weaker Thunderhawk.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:15 am 
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List has an upgrade 'Heavy Support' but no formation has this as an allowed upgrade.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:36 am 
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Ah good catch!
Tacticals, Devastators, Siege Assaults and Terminators should get it.
Also tacticals should loose their Rhinos if they take Siege Mantlets as these are to bulky (doesn't prevent them to be transported by Land Raiders and Caesti).
Edit: V0.2 with these corrections included now available.

I'm tempted to allow it also for Predator, Vindicator and Whirlwind Detachments.

A point of note: IA10 mentiones the Sons of Medusa (Iron Hands Successor Chapter) by name as a fitting Chapter to use this list (and it also mentiones the Minotaurs but i find the Sons of Medusa more fitting see below).

Also GW mintioned that the Sons o Medusa like to use lots of tanks.
IA 10 lists the Chapter as consisting of 3 War Clans. Each War Clans consists of 3 Companies. 1 Battle Company, 1 Tactical Company and 1 Support Company (the former two conforming roughly to their Codex equivalents, while the Support Company comprises a mixture of Devastator, Assault and Veteran Squads). Additionally rather than a dedicated Scout Company, each War Clan maintains abody of recruits andinitiates whichit considers to be an auxiliary force.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:21 pm 
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Missed points cost for the Siege Dreadnought Talon. Correct V0.2.1 now downladable.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:09 pm 
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A nice start, I like the variation/difference from codex, and siege is a good way to focus on underused models like dreadnaughts etc.

One problem I see is the caestus has planetfall, but there is no spaceship available in the list.


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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 2:11 pm 
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Well i guess if an orbital operation isn't working and the Space Marines are actually commencing a siege then Spacecrafts have already been proven to be useless.
The Caestus is by definition a space capable vessel so it has Planetfall evenif it can't use it in this list.

I wouldl ike to test this list against Imperial Fists, Baran or Mossinians as the Siege Assault Vanguard would be the direct antithesis of these :)

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:33 am 
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BL, as per Dave's view here:
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=21921

If you're ok with it, I'll slot the Caestus into the upgrades section of the Vanguard list and adjust for the formations that can use it.

Maybe discuss this with Dave if you have any issues with the change?

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:26 am 
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Is this list actually needed anymore?
It seems to be duplicating the Imperial Fists list fairly closely?

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:51 am 
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The Imperial Fists list would be a "Siege Defence Sternguard" kind of thing.
While the Imperial Fists are more Baran Siegemaster like the Assault Siege Vanguard is more Deathkorps like.

@Caestus: I laid down my reasonings in the linked thread. And my post above
Quote:
Yes. Ideally the Caestus would be an Armoured Venicle and/or Aircraft which could transport units not from it's own formation.
But as everyone seems to believe that independent transport vehicles are to complicated i put two Ceasti on the same base and call it a War Engine Aircraft with DC2.
I choosed 2 because 3 seemed even more far fetched.
This restricts the transportable formations in this list to the (standard) Assault Detachment and the Siege Terminator Detachment.
This makes the Caestus a weaker Thunderhawk.

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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:13 pm 
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Evil and Chaos wrote:
Is this list actually needed anymore?
It seems to be duplicating the Imperial Fists list fairly closely?

I feel a similar way but people should be free to experiment :) I'm not going to say "no can't include it" because somethings might come out of the 2 lists that might enhance either list etc.


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 Post subject: Re: Siege Assault Vanguard
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:36 pm 
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Despite that i myself support the idea to drop this list from the Compendium i willtry to develope them further.
Well this thread is now almost two years old...ehm. Nevermind.

Herre is some playtesting feedbacki got:

Thunderfire Cannons are good. Very good indeed. They can garrison, they have long range and with Ignore Cover are very effective against Infantry. Increasing the cost by +25pts tp 275pts for the four unit formation seems appropiate.

Land Raider Archilles where only used in a 4000pts game as for smaller games they are perceived as to expensive for their short range. But they seem to have punch if they get into range.

Dreadnought Talonis described as "fun to play with" despide being slow and having a low damage output.

Lists used where:

2* Siege Terminator + Chaplain
1* Devastatoren mit 2 Siege Devs + Rhino
1* Devastatoren mit 2 Siege Devs + Rhinos und 3 Hunter
1* Tactical mit 2 Siege Tacticals, Supreme, Rhinos, 1 Razorback and 3 Predatoren (BTS)
2* Thunderfire Cannons
1* Siege Dreadnought Talon
1* Marauder Bomber

And at 4000pts:
Same as above plus:
1* Thunderbolts
1* Warhound Pack
1* Assault Detachment + 2 x Achilles


Opponents where Grey Knights and LatD.

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