Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 92 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list

 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:41 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid

Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 1:32 pm
Posts: 4893
Location: North Yorkshire
Quote:
I dislike the one-shot missiles on the storm ravens intensely, I think I'd rather add in the hurrcane bolters and twin HB, and reduce the missiles to a single AT4+ shot but remove the one shot rule to keep them useful throughout the game.... I understand this steps on the toes of the grey knights somewhat, I think we should test them out either way

You've not played enough Guard then.

Thanks for the feedback

_________________
_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk - home of the UK Epic tournament scene
NetEA NetERC Xenos Lists Chair
NetEA Ork + Feral Ork + Speed Freak Champion


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:16 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
Tiny-Tim wrote:
You've not played enough Guard then.


only every week for ~2 years ;) that was pretty much enough for me....

but seriously vultures have massive range, are AT2+ so a credible threat to even very heavily armoured stuff, and are scouts so can start off garrisoned on overwatch, often in very uncomfortable places, that is their niche and I'd rather the marines have a CAS gunship type unit than one that delivers a payload at extreme range then flaps around trying not to die.... one of the complaints earlier in the thread was that storm ravens were essentially better vultures

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 1:23 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:24 pm
Posts: 9624
Location: Manalapan, FL
They should be assault monsters, not playing like vultures. If you're going to play at being Solomon and split the proverbial child in half, then dropping the one-shot is a good idea and just make it a regular missile attack. I'd not be concerned with stepping on the GK's toes because 1. it's less tested and far newer a list than the BA, 2. it's already a custom named variant there so it doesn't matter, 3. we probably should just make this a custom variant here too as it really seems this unit, more so than most, is really used in a force specific tactics manner (assault transport vs a gunship) and we might want to make that explicit [shrugs] 2 cents.

edit: gunslinger actually made them match the BA list in his last release of the GK list so not even an issue now

_________________
He's a lawyer and a super-villian. That's like having a shark with a bazooka!

-I HAVE NO POINT
-Penal Legion-Fan list
-Help me make Whitescars not suck!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 1:50 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 9476
Location: Worcester, MA
CaptPiett and I haven't found them worth their points in our games. The last one or two playtests we've played them with these stats at 50 points each when they're replacing rhinos, and 275 for a formation of 4:

Code:
Storm Raven    AV    35cm    5+    6+    5+
Assault Cannons             30cm      AP4+/AT4+
Twin Heavy Bolter           30cm      AP4+
2x Blood Strike Missiles    45cm      AT5+, SS
2x Hurricane Bolters        (15cm)    Small Arms, EA(+1)

Transport (2 inf, 1 dread), Planetfall, RA, Skimmer


They're more of a Vulture/Valkyrie combination. They lack the long range AT hitting power of the Vulture, so you want to get up and close with them like the Valkyrie. They benefit from the better armor and the FF/support bump, which I think makes them play more marine-y.

_________________
Dave

Blog

NetEA Tournament Pack Website

Squats 2019-10-17


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 2:03 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 01, 2014 2:48 am
Posts: 938
Location: NJ, USA
jimmyzimms wrote:
gunslinger actually made them match the BA list in his last release of the GK list so not even an issue now


Don't not change stats based on the GKs. There was similar discussion in the GK thread that the Stormtalons are an underperforming unit. I brought them in line with Dave's proposed changes so that we'd have two groups with the same goal working towards the same end, plus it helps with consistency across lists. If there's a new stat line we want to try for the ST, I'll make a quick edit to the GK list to much it, since the list has only been up for 8 hours or so.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

_________________
Grey Knights AC: viewtopic.php?f=130&t=33750

Tau AC: viewforum.php?

Net EA Chair

The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 2:38 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
Dave wrote:
CaptPiett and I haven't found them worth their points in our games. The last one or two playtests we've played them with these stats at 50 points each when they're replacing rhinos, and 275 for a formation of 4:

Code:
Storm Raven    AV    35cm    5+    6+    5+
Assault Cannons             30cm      AP4+/AT4+
Twin Heavy Bolter           30cm      AP4+
2x Blood Strike Missiles    45cm      AT5+, SS
2x Hurricane Bolters        (15cm)    Small Arms, EA(+1)

Transport (2 inf, 1 dread), Planetfall, RA, Skimmer


They're more of a Vulture/Valkyrie combination. They lack the long range AT hitting power of the Vulture, so you want to get up and close with them like the Valkyrie. They benefit from the better armor and the FF/support bump, which I think makes them play more marine-y.


I think 275pts is pretty damn cheap for that level of firepower and utility.... I happily pay 275pts for predator annihilators, given the increased speed, resilience and utility (very decent AP shooting) I think my opponents would be pretty annoyed with them at 275.....

I'm of a mind to split the difference, use the stats in this post, except to give them a single AT4+ bloodstrike missile with no single shot, and cost them at 300

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 3:14 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 9476
Location: Worcester, MA
I didn't think they were that bad, but I was only using them as upgrades. The 275 was extrapolated from there.

The missiles are just Krak missiles, twined they make sense at AT5+ and fit the pattern for EA weapon stats. Going to AT4+ with no single shot makes for nearly a Falcon's AT with better initiative, armor, FF, transport and SR. I think 300 would be too cheap in that instance. I'd try them at a single AT5+ with no SS at 300.

_________________
Dave

Blog

NetEA Tournament Pack Website

Squats 2019-10-17


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 3:32 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
agreed, let's test at that (I was not aware they are just Krak missiles)

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:03 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
okay let's go with that then :) unfortunately I've either lost or deleted my word file for the list, I'll get an updated version published on tuesday

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:04 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
where did your post about typhoon launchers go Dave?

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:05 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 9476
Location: Worcester, MA
Deleted it, I was looking at the Talon.

The missile is actually longer range now, looks like. 72" as opposed to 48". Upping them to 60cm or 75cm would fit in with 40k, but I don't think players would be using them to get infantry into assaults. I'm fine at 45cm AT5+ at 300.

_________________
Dave

Blog

NetEA Tournament Pack Website

Squats 2019-10-17


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:42 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
Agreed

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 10:36 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
Got another game in last night, tested the storm ravens at 300pts with twin assault cannons, twin HB, a single AT5+ shot and twin hurricane bolters, they seemed pretty good, albeit not superpowered....

Will write up the game in this post when this damn headache eases off

I took

Tacticals - hunter, vindicator, supcom - 500
Death Company - jump packs, 2x dreads - 475
Assaults - 2 extra stands, furioso dread, chaplain - 350
Devs - 250
Scouts - laserback - 175
Scouts - 150
Storm Ravens - 300
Strike Cruiser - 200
Storm Talons - 200
Thunderhawk - 200
Thunderhawk - 200

Dave took EpicUK world eaters, something like

Retinue - Warlord, pact, 2 destroyers
Retinue - pact, 2 destroyers
Retinue - pact, 2 destroyers
Retinue - pact (dreadclaws), 2 destroyers
Terminators - pact
Hellcannons
Lord of battle
Spaceship
Hellblades
hellblades

Having looked I just realised he has 1050 in his 1/3 allowance, but hey how

Game started with strike Cruiser hitting one retinue for decent damage, the podding Devs however did very little and were promptly eaten by a nearby lord of battles, he CAPed a formation of hellblades and shot down my storm Talons :(

The death company and assault marines blatted his supcom retinue and the hellcannons, the scouts sat on OW near my objectives on the left for most of the game, there were a lot of big engagements in the game which was pretty brutal, Dave took my BTS but couldn't get over to capture enough objectives after I stripped his rhinos, it ended as a draw at the end of T4 with Dave up 1-0

The list felt good, powerful as you would expect, and was mostly able to go toe to toe with the world eaters, the assault marines performed as assault marines should, the storm ravens are an excellent reserve unit, and death company with 2 dreads in a thunderhawk makes a suitably deadly thunderhawk load

I think the reduced costs on the assault marine upgrade (2 stands for 50pts) coupled with the improved storm ravens really help the list, there were also a couple of moments when the red thirst rule forced me to take risks when I didn't want to feed the remnants of my death company into a nearby terminator retinue (jump packs are a curse in that regard!)

Overall, pleased with the shape of the list, keen to push it forward to approval now :)

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:20 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 9476
Location: Worcester, MA
Too much Wassail?

_________________
Dave

Blog

NetEA Tournament Pack Website

Squats 2019-10-17


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: NetEA Blood Angels V3.0 list
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 5:50 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:03 pm
Posts: 6353
Location: Leicester UK
Dave wrote:
Too much Wassail?


Nothing as cool as that, had a terrible night's sleep thanks to my darling daughter (aged 3) continually waking me up, ostensibly to ask what I was doing.... "Well sweetheart I *was* sleeping...."

_________________
NetEA Space Marine, Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Army Champion

NetEA Red Corsairs Army Champion

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 92 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net