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Field of Glory - opinions
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:02 pm 
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Field of Glory has been out now for a short while, but there has not been a lot of comments about it on these boards. So, I thought that what the web really needs is another thread on this rules set!  :;):

I know that a few of you guys now have it, and I wondered what you thought of it.

I have read through the rules but not yet played a game, so bear that in mind. Also, I have a few Ancients rules sets, but would not consider myself an expert.

I found FoG to be quite a confused rules set. It feels like the writers want to emphasise that these rules are for fun games at home, but at the same time are clearly written to perform at tournament play.

The book is well laid out, nice to look at and interesting to read... but it needs to be. I found reading the rules like reading a legal contract. This is a confusing set to sit and read through, partly due to the way that it is set out, and partly due to the writers trying to get every eventuality into the rules. For example, the movement rules deal with all movement in the same space, leaving me feeling that it is really more complicated than it should be. The rules on movement start on page 40... and finally end on page 78! All that for moving troops.

On top of this, there are lots of sub-cases For example, troops can activate to move, and these can be simple of complex moves. Complex moves require a test. OK, not so difficult. Then there is a table setting out the troop type and the move, and listing whether it is simple or complex for that troop type. Then you have the issue of mixed battle groups, with different troop types. And then you have difficult moves - leading to the question of whether a unit can make a difficult, simple move and/or a difficult/complex move... and exactly what a difficult move means.

I am sure that there is a really good set of rules in there, and I am sure that after a couple of games it will all make sense, but on the first reading there are just a lot of 'you can do this... unless x... except in y cases.... but if troops are of type z'.

I can imagine the first game or two being fairly long, painful affairs.

So, what do you guys think?

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Mephiston
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:48 pm 
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It reads better than DBM and has examples! Not tried playing it yet so it is all a little confusing. I think the general opinion is that the first few games are a bit slow but speed up pretty quickly.
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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 7:52 pm 
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I have created a page on the Wiki for FoG. Feel free to contribute.

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Markconz
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:06 pm 
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I'm about to play a 6 game tournament. Will let you know... :)

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Sergeant_Crunch
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 3:12 am 
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First, thanks for starting this thread.  I still haven't made up my mind on a set of ancients rules.  A friend has lent me a copy of WAB, and am reading through it, though I can't shake the feeling that I want to play in smaller scales.

You say that movement covers 38 pages.  How much of that is pictures, examples, and charts?  The preview pages on their website and the textual descriptions I've seen elsewhere make it seem like every page has a pretty picture or a diagram of some sort on it.

I think the contractual feel is because they want to cover as many potential cases that could arise in tournament play.  I've always had the feeling that these games were being written as an attempt to displace the DBx games as the tournament standards.

How do the combat rules read.  Does it seem like combat is a straightforward process, or do the players have to make multiple rolls consulting modifier charts every time?  I've gotten lazy and used to systems that attempt to use as few charts as possible.  I want to push pewter and roll dice, not refer to charts.

Are the morale rules confusing?  I've seen comments that units degrade slowly rather that being fine one moment and a routed mob the next.

I'm sure I'll have more questions later.  I figure I have until those plastic figure lines come out before I make a decision.

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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 12:20 pm 
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I think that the easiest way to describe the movement is that 80 percent of it is simple. But, 80 percent of the space in the section is taken up describing events that only come up rarely. For example, there is a table stating what type of move each type of troop can take, and whether a command check is needed. Most movement will use the same couple of pages. Then there are lots of pages describing realligning troops in close combat, evade and pursuit, and so on. These are where the confusion comes in.

That said, there are several examples and diagrams. It is one of those rules sets where you really need to play the game to get it. Reading through the rules just gives you lots of situations that you wont need and are difficult to picture in your head. When you play it, you will a specific situation come up, and the rules will deal with it.

Does that help?

Units have a 'ladder' of states, from 'steady' to 'broken'. This cohesion is really where the battle is won, and comes up in shooting effects, close combat and psychology. It is a nice encompassing mechanic.

If you are looking for an ancient game:

1. Do you want individual basing, or element basing?

2. What periods specifically interest you?

3. Do you want fast play, or realism?

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vanvlak
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 1:24 pm 
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1- Individual
2- 1300BC-1700AD
3 - 65% fast with 35% realism

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Sergeant_Crunch
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 11:51 pm 
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1. uncommitted
2. mostly ancients, maybe some medieval or SYW later on
3. fast play with some recognition of realism.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 11:54 pm 
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If you after fast play over realism then either of the Warhammer historical systems would probably suit you best in the first instance. The rules are basically the same as Warhammer / Warmaster with tweaks to add some realism.
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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:04 am 
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1- Individual
2- 1300BC-1700AD
3 - 65% fast with 35% realism


If you after fast play over realism then either of the Warhammer historical systems would probably suit you best in the first instance. The rules are basically the same as Warhammer / Warmaster with tweaks to add some realism.

Agreed. At the risk of being obvious, Warhammer Ancient Battles. The mechanics and rules engine should be fairly familiar, the rules give a apassable historic result and it is one of the minority of ancients sets using individual basing.

There are also a growing number of suppliments (when will they release Divine Wind!?). But.... you knew all of this already!  :p

1. uncommitted
2. mostly ancients, maybe some medieval or SYW later on
3. fast play with some recognition of realism.

Have you looked at the Two Hour Wargames offerings? They dont go quite as far back as ancients, but do Medieval and later, and I know that you are a 5150 fan.

Alternatively, really just avoid Warrior (WRG 7th) as this is no-where near fast play!  :D

Have a look at Field of Glory, Piquet, Armati or DBx. I suspect that Piquet: Archeron may interest you.

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vanvlak
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:21 am 
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In fact (and it seems I've done the right thing) I have both WHAB and WMAB :)
WMAB is compact and includes some 24 lists; WHAB had some grand supplements, and I've already decided that some army from The Art of War will be the last army I will purchase. Note that this is at least my 5th such nominated army..

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Sergeant_Crunch
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 3:51 pm 
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I've been reading WAB (borrowed a copy) and like it, I just don't like the bucket'o'dice approach, but may end up going with it anyway.  If nothing else, it already has support and players.  I'll have to look into Piquet and Armati.

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Markconz
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:26 am 
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There's a new FOG review posted here:
www.wargamesjournal.com

I finished my 6 round FOG competition yesterday. I went in basically raw to the rules, having only had them for a week previously. It was a good way to learn them. Will put together some thoughts on them when I have some more time.

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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:33 am 
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(Markconz @ Mar. 24 2008,04:26)
QUOTE
There's a new FOG review posted here:
www.wargamesjournal.com

I finished my 6 round FOG competition yesterday. I went in basically raw to the rules, having only had them for a week previously. It was a good way to learn them. Will put together some thoughts on them when I have some more time.

Ummm... in the forum? I cant seem to find this, but I am looking forward to your thoughts on the system for starter to playing a years worth of games in a weekend!

I assume that WJ is now officially dead, since it has been inactive for a while.

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Markconz
 Post subject: Field of Glory - opinions
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:50 am 
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(CyberShadow @ Mar. 24 2008,08:33)
QUOTE
Ummm... in the forum? I cant seem to find this...

It's down the bottom on the main page in the "Latest Reviews" reviews section.

Re the second point about it being dead(?) I see this at the top of the page:

We're very pleased to announce that Wargames Journal is finally back online . With 2007 well and truly behind us we are now ready to face 2008 and all that it brings to the world of wargaming.

The magazine now has a new Editor - Rich Jones - and a new focus. We've managed to bring all of its old articles back and they are presented to you as a mix of HTML pages and Adobe PDF files. Our latest PDF will be avalable for free download very soon.

The site will add rolling content, such as reviews and news snippets, on an ad hoc basis. The full blown PDF magazine will be available as a bi-monthly download.

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