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Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter

 Post subject: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 12:18 pm 
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I'm very shocked to see that i have no chance to buy more DRM or Exodus War Minis. The Exodus Owner make his minis to buy for shapeways. Better than nothing. But Shapeways is too expensive. The Euro lost his value to the dollar and i don't love the german custom.

Too expensive and slow.

I make with my friends a scifi RPG and Tabletop for myself and when the rules are good, we go over to Kickstarter.
As Placeholder i use epic and DRM, Plasmablast. The next i wanted to buy this year was Exodus Wars. Sadly i'm too late.

I think over to make a Kickstarter to open a shop too make them available for normal cost and not the cost from Shapeways.

3D printing is for my the only option, white metal is too intensive (Noise, Place etc). Slow Pruduction is the downside.

I want that the mini life.

But the otherside is. I life in Berlin and in the early 90's was a great epic scene with tournament's like Ogerquest who play in one table 20 people and but in the meantime, nothing dead.

We must realistic, Onslaught and co are great examples for success, but the most buyers are old Epic Players and not newbies. The Market has limited potential and has not the attraction.

6mm is for most wargamers, and they playing Field of War etc.

Exodus Wars has other minis from Onslaught and a other(I dont know the name), know anywhere too buy it in Europe?


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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 12:55 pm 
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Update, DRM is not closed but he his busy.


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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:51 pm 
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mictator wrote:

But the otherside is. I life in Berlin and in the early 90's was a great epic scene with tournament's like Ogerquest who play in one table 20 people and but in the meantime, nothing dead.


Off topic but Berlin has a very active Epic group with quite a lot of players and regular tournaments

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:39 pm 
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But not in the Shops. There are GW Turniers and other. These is then a closed Subculture.

No playing in the shops, no newbies.

I think that is not the Topic here, but thanks. You can send me adress or internet adress from this players, i'm very curious.


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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:42 pm 
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Brumbaer and Iron Duke on this forum

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:01 pm 
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Thanks, but let it please the new post only to the hopefully Exodus Wars Kickstarter.


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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 5:39 pm 
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Nice idea and noble concept. A few things that you will need to figure out before starting on a venture like this (and yes, I understand this is more of the exploratory concept post than a business plan ;D) is
-are you thinking of a buyout for the entire IP or just restricting it to the models/moulds them selves?
-How's ownership to be determined precisely? Is this a "community owned" LLC (or the like) that provides these at a particular cost? Or are you thinking of running EW v2.0 The Company and the kickstarter is envisioned as collecting the bootstrap capital to run this?

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:07 am 
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This is an interesting idea, and I have to admit to having similar thoughts myself over the last week or two. To work out if this is realistic, you (or anyone doing this) would need some realistic numbers, such as:
- cost of materials (white metal)
- cost per run, and how the designs are distributed across a spin
- shipping costs, both domestic (whatever that means) and international
- cost of the files and IP from EW themselves

There is a real danger of making a significant loss in any KS, especially in a campaign where the products have been freely available at retail for many years. That said, if it did go ahead, the result would be a first run, and the transfer of the relevant files and property for future runs, and this could be done in sections (Guild for the first campaign, etc).

In theory, the ground work is done, and its just production costs above aquiring the license/IP that would need to be covered by a campaign.

Its a very tempting proposition......

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:51 pm 
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I don't know what discussions Tom has had/is having behind the scenes, but like CS this is something I have been thinking about myself. I expect there are some clear product lines from EW that should be able to support a viable business, provided the costs can be controlled. And there is also a need for a EU distributor for Onslaught - whether those things need to be in the same business is not certain of course. A vertically integrated business (manufacture, distribution & sales) could be efficient, but also risky and hard to set up.

With respect to mictator, I don't think diving into Kickstarter is the right way. From your post, it sounds to me like your idea is to raise money to fund the startup of a company that will sell 3D printed models based on designs you do not own, at lower prices than specialist 3D printing companies. There is a lot wrong with that... However even if the IP can be bought from Steel Crown, there needs to be some careful consideration of how best to do this, ideally we would concentrate our support in one direction. There are good reasons why these products are made available in metal, and to not do that because you don't have the skills/knowledge/interest is the wrong way of thinking about it: rather, the best outcome for the community is to have people with the right motivation and expertise to run things shrewdly. If, of course, they are willing.

I do think there is scope for a community-backed project to acquire the IP, review the product lines with a market review and continue a high-quality production capacity (almost certainly in metal). For commercial reasons I think we need to think carefully about the structure of such a company and whether the capital it has available should be public information... i.e. investors/donators need to have assurances and legal recourse to ensure that the money is being used effectively, but the value of the IP needs to be assessed on a commercial basis not "however much money the kickstarter raised". It is no good owning the IP if you can't afford to make it available for sale at a price people are willing to pay. Once the groundwork has been laid, it could however make sense to raise capital to acquire the IP/moulds and re-start production via kickstarter, based on prior negotiations with Steel Crown.

Is anyone interested in discussing this further/might be interested in getting involved? Or perhaps you already have some plans yourself?

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:58 pm 
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Well said Kyrt.


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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:04 pm 
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It should be noted that much of the range, and IMHO some of the most important pieces of that range, are NOT CAD designed figures. One such example: Edenite infantry as I understand it were traditionally sculpted by Bob Naismith. As cool as all the tanks and APCs are, that's a market that's pretty well covered on multiple 6mm lines as opposed to some of the other parts of the catalog which have no such replacements.

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:54 pm 
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Exactly Jimmy.

Regarding the product range: if I'm being honest there are parts that, if it were me, I would probably not sell (for different reasons). But IMO these things should be decided in an analytical way. Nothing should be there if it does not pay its way, but equally if someone deserves to be there it should be.

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:13 pm 
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Slightly off topic but I have it on good authority that Onslaught are in negotiations with a possible UK stockist as we speak. 8)

Unable to divulge who at this time but keep a look out for an announcement sometime soon. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Discussion Thread for DRM and Exodus Wars Kickstarter
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 9:37 pm 
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Woo ! Best news all day !


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