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allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting

 Post subject: allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:41 pm 
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How do people play this bit from 3.2.1

Quote:
If a formation includes both war engines and non-war engine units then an attacker must state whether any attacks he makes on the formation will be directed at the war engines or the other units in the formation. Attacks directed at the war engines can only be allocated against war engines if they hit, while attacks directed at other units may not be allocated to the war engines in the formation.


Do you allow not declaring any of the attacks and just allocate them closest to furthest?

There's no mention of allocating attacks to WE in an assault, but I always assumed all the 3.2.1 rules from War Engine Shooting applied to this as 1.12.5 says:

Quote:
Each player allocates the hits and make saving throws in the same manner as they would when allocating hits from shooting


I've never thought about it, but I think that means you can potentially limit where your opponent can assign hits in an assault when a formation has both WEs and non-WEs. As an example, you could say "none of these FF attacks are going on the Gorgon, they're all going on your infantry". Assuming all your units are within 15cm and have a line of fire to an infantry unit you should be able to do that by my reading.

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 Post subject: Re: allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:37 pm 
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Just thought about this myself! Any expert views?

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 Post subject: Re: allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:05 pm 
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Really interesting spot Dave.
I had always played this as applying to shooting only, so you declare the shooting dice used on each part of the formation, WE and non-WE.

I thought Assaults got played in the usual way, hits being allocated nearest to furthest by the defender. So where a Gorgon was placed in the front of the assault, it soaked off the relevant number of hits before other hits were applied to the infantry.

Declaring that your assaulting units were only fighting the enemy infantry, even though at least one of them is in B-B with the gorgon would seem to cause a number of difficulties. One being that the player could get several units in b-b with the gorgon, getting the benefit of better factors, but applying the hits to weaker targets elsewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:12 pm 
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Dave wrote:
How do people play this bit from 3.2.1

Quote:
If a formation includes both war engines and non-war engine units then an attacker must state whether any attacks he makes on the formation will be directed at the war engines or the other units in the formation. Attacks directed at the war engines can only be allocated against war engines if they hit, while attacks directed at other units may not be allocated to the war engines in the formation.


Do you allow not declaring any of the attacks and just allocate them closest to furthest?

There's no mention of allocating attacks to WE in an assault, but I always assumed all the 3.2.1 rules from War Engine Shooting applied to this as 1.12.5 says:

Quote:
Each player allocates the hits and make saving throws in the same manner as they would when allocating hits from shooting


I've never thought about it, but I think that means you can potentially limit where your opponent can assign hits in an assault when a formation has both WEs and non-WEs. As an example, you could say "none of these FF attacks are going on the Gorgon, they're all going on your infantry". Assuming all your units are within 15cm and have a line of fire to an infantry unit you should be able to do that by my reading.


you have to read 3.2.1 in conjunction with 3.2
Quote:
3.2 WAR ENGINE SHOOTING
The following special rules apply when shooting either at or with war engines. In general, war engines are treated in the same manner as armoured vehicle targets (ie, any hit that would affect an armoured vehicle can affect a war engine). Any exceptions to this are noted below


Also remember shooting/attacks and allocating of hits are not the same thing.
1.12.5 talks about allocating hits in the same manner as you would from shooting not making those attacks in the same manner as you would with shooting.


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 Post subject: Re: allocating hits to WEs when shooting/assaulting
PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:25 pm 
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Ginger wrote:
I thought Assaults got played in the usual way, hits being allocated nearest to furthest by the defender. So where a Gorgon was placed in the front of the assault, it soaked off the relevant number of hits before other hits were applied to the infantry.


We've played it the same way. My thoughts went something like this:

  • No where in War Engine Assaults (3.3) does it say you allocate hits like you're talking about
  • That part actually comes from War Engine Shooting (3.2.1)
  • We use a combination of 1.12.5 and 3.2.1 to guide us in applying hits to WEs in an assault
  • Why don't we use the other bits from 3.2.1 (saying these hits are/aren't going on the WEs) and 1.12.5 in an assault?

Ginger wrote:
Declaring that your assaulting units were only fighting the enemy infantry, even though at least one of them is in B-B with the gorgon would seem to cause a number of difficulties. One being that the player could get several units in b-b with the gorgon, getting the benefit of better factors, but applying the hits to weaker targets elsewhere.


I just find it odd that you can ignore a WE and hit the tanks behind it if you're shooting within 15cm, but you can't do the same when assaulting. The "flying CC attacks" you're getting at I'm more comfortable with just sweeping under the rug the same way we do with flying powerfists.

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