Pre-Heresy Legion organisation is really doing my head in ! An old subject I know but one that has had me doing all sorts of maths to figure the correct structure and unit designations.

Its the heresy novels fault....

When the heresy novels speak of inner circles of captins or senior commanders and their personal companys it makes me do the maths (Just finished shadows of treachery)


Here's what I've worked out regarding the Ultamarines. The aim is to help organise one of my marine armys using Space Marine 1st edition army lists as per WD126. Ive drawn upon 20 years of background fluff, fiction, novels, the Codex and what just seems right.

A Legion of aprox 250000.

Divided into 250 Chapters of 10000 ( each chapter numbed 1,2,3 etc ).

A Chapter numberd divided into 10 Grand Companys of a 1000 marines each (each grand company numbed 1,2,3 etc)

A Grand Company being divided into Regiments of aprox 300 marines each (each numbed 1,2,3 etc)

Divided into 3 battalions per regiment (each numbed 1,2,3 etc within a individual Chapter only)

Which each have 3 line companys each ( each numbed 1,2,3 etc within an individual Chapter only)

A line company having 3 detachments each. These supported at battalion level with seperate detachments.

Not forgeting regimental level support units.

My Ultramarine army consists of around two thousand marines including landraiders, mole morters. vindicators, Capitol Imperialis and every other model available to Marines (and my collection).

So, my example being,

12th Chapter

111th Grand company
331st regiment, battalions 1,2 and 3.
332nd regiment, battalions 4,5 and 6
333rd regiment, battalion 7,8 and 9
Line companys 1 to 27.

112th Grand company
334th regiment, battalions 10,11 and 12
335th regiment, battalion 13,14 and 15
336th regimant, battalion 16,17 and 18
Line comapanys 28 to 54.

If I were to go on the 12th chapter would number grand companys 111th -120th, regiments 331 -360, battalions and line comapanys 1 to well, you get the idear.

Also, I intend to add a "penal" battalion in some where. Just so I can have a body of troops with red helmets !

I want to add a 12th chapter command unit in here some where too ? A powerful commander in charge of 10 Grand companys no less. One of 250 such commanders. If anyone is interested I also have started working out unit colours, divisional and corps struture .

An interesting and fun thing of note is that inventing regiments has enabled me to use second founding forebears. My 334th regiment are the Doom Eagles. Hence their silver and red regimental theam.

Thoughts please.

OK OK, I get it.

I thought you peeps would find this more interesting than my girlfreind evidentley does, but to be fair this subject has been dragged around for ages.

Since posting this I saw a review of forge worlds Horus Heresy book on BOLs. Legion organisation has been detailed very well in this. Has anyone seen, heard or read about this ?

Better still has anyone got a copy yet ? At £70 a pop I won't have a copy any time soon.

Hi,

I've treated myself to the Betrayal book recently (I didn't put up much resistance and managed to convince myself how important this book was)

Anyway, the book gives a full breakdown of a 'sample' Legion organisation (late era Great Crusade) :

At the top level, we have the Primarch and various layers of high ranking Legion officials.

Then we move down to the combat organisation. At the highest level are Chapters (originally 1000 Marines but increasing as the Legions grew).

Each chapter is divided into 2 Battalions (yay for old style Epic titles !). 500 bods in each

Each Battalion is then divided into 5 Companies. 100 bods in each
Company I = Veterans
Company II, III & IV = Line
Company V = Specialist units (assault or outrider or destroyer)

Each Company is divided into three groups, each comprising 2 x tactical squads and 1 x Support squad.

Each level of the organisation has its own HQ and allocated assets (eg. most spacecraft are allocated at Chapter level).

The book stresses the different titles given to these organisations (eg some Legions used Great Company instead of Chapter etc) and the fact that this is a 'codex' start point which is changed by the growing size of Legions and different Primarch decisions etc.

Lots more detail in the book.

Hope this helps a bit !


Phil

Hi

Thanks heaps. That helps more than a bit. And thanks for sharing info about the new book with those like me who have not got the funds at the mo...soon, soon (rubs hand together).

An interesting break down, and mostley expected. Shame there is no mention about regiments though I assume this term can also mean Chapter or Grand Company.

I hope the BB heresy novels pick up on this. They always talk in terms of companys. But i won't start on that again.

Is there much repition in the book, i.e. the same pictures as in visions of treachery etc ?

Battalions were alternatively designated as Cohorts, Regiments, Battlegroups, etc.

As quoted in the book, hope this helps.

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Hi

Thanks More dakka. I have closure.

Is there much repition in the book, i.e. the same pictures as in visions of treachery etc ?

I have the four Visions books and, as far as I can tell, the art in Betrayal is all new. Particularly nice are the images of the Marines themselves - some very evocative pictures with great detail (8-10 per Legion). I love the Emperor's Children pics - very nice colour combinations and, as you would expect, lots of embellishment.

Cheers,

Phil

Hi

Thanks glorfindel. This book does sounds amazing.

Does anyone know which books are in the pipe line ?