So add him as a character instead?

BTW Elsmore, what figs did you use to do the Harlequin character models?

I'm 100% with you on this. The Harlequins of lore and of regular 40K are allies occasionally seen (not often due to overpricing etc) in Eldar and Dark Eldar armies. They should be the same in Epic. Not having them thus is just ...silly.

Why make things more complicated with more special rules? Why force opposing players to learn even more things about a special army? Why be a special snowflake? Just have them as allies, bump up the points cost to where only fluff-driven and sentimental people like myself would use them, and make sure they don't become a one-shot one-kill "I WIN" button. Then bump up the points cost to the point where people go "oh well, I'll never take that since I want to win" and then we're fine.

There's no need to have a special rule for every single unit on the board. It just slows things down and confuses people.

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TBH Oathed, if they're only there to put in for fluffophiles, the work to put them in and balance them isn't necessarily proportionate. Lists for NetEA generally are to be used for everyone, anybody and possibly in tournaments as well. If you really want to represent them with high points and huge stats so that only fluffophiles will want to take them, then it's simpler to just play them as a house rule within your own group. This isn't to say you can't make them balanced for everyone to use it's just a slow process but the end result will be good for everyone as it promotes character and is fluffy.

As an example, the Sanguinary Guard in the Blood Angels list is a similar issue. They're a formation that's an expensive glass cannon but they're, IMO at least, a very interesting addition to the list for the above reasons.

I get your point, and I get that you're mostly focused on the TT function of the Sang Guard - but the Sanguinary Guard is not taken at will by random Space Marine armies in 40K, or by Chaos Marines. They're associated with one single Space Marine Chapter list - it's really an issue with that Chapter, and that Chapter only. If they're not included in regular play or tournaments - then only that Chapter's players or fans will care much. Here you're ripping a previously fairly included and standard part of TWO factions in the game, right out of the heart of their lists. There's been plenty of Space Marine codices and lists published with no mention of the Sanguinary Guard - there's been no Eldar/DE [WRONG!] codices that I know of published without mentioning Harlequins. [EDIT: DE only got them in 6th Ed?]

All I'm asking for is simple, no-nonsense, moderate-to-high-cost units. Then it's done, and the problem can be forgotten about, or tweaked long-term if need be. No need to re-invent the wheel with massive new special rules sections that need to be looked up by a confused opponent. Hard-hitting melee units (excl. Death Jesters) that are hard to hit, but die easily. Done. Simple, easy. Why work harder than you need to?

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All good points....

They are really nice Counts As Howling Banshees, until such time as there is more demand and developer time to make them more than that.

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The main reason why Harlequins are not seen very much in 40K these days is because they are not very effective.

The core list for Eldar is Biel-Tan. Harlequins do not have strong ties to Biel-Tan at all. In fact, it is the craftworld which is the least likely to have Harlequins as allies, so not having Harlequins in the core Eldar list actually makes a lot of sense, from a background perspective. If you really want to field Harlequins as an allied detachment to Eldar without any fuss, then you might find NetEpic to be more your cup of tea .



Here is the crux of the problem though. How do you make them sufficiently distinct from, and more powerful than, close assault Aspect Warriors (they are meant to be more powerful than the Aspects after all) without making their rules too complicated or making them overpowered?

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@ Oathed, I have answered some of these points here

As Dobbsy and Irisado say, the Harlequins need to be developed as a separate list for many reasons. The units and formations have so many abilities it is easier to list what they do not have. If this approach is valid, the only variables are the number of units and the formation costs. What changes are you suggesting?

The only thing that is absent is the portable Web-way portal in the E-UK DE list. Adding this would automatically give the Harlies more mobility . . . . is this something that needs to be added?

Turns out I was wrong about including harlequins in all dark eldar historical army lists.

As far as my own proposals, I have little to no play experience with which to back them up, so don't listen to me for rules. I'm just a guy who wants Harlequins to be an allied unit to Eldar and DE, like in 40K, and was disappointed when I found out they're not in all Epic rule sets.

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Oathed, this is where Fan-lists come into play. That's a good thing to do and have.

NetEA lists are about producing widely applicable tournament ready/balanced lists. I've got a couple fan lists in my signature that are great fun to play but I have little intention of trying to slot them into a tournament style of play (they're really intended to used with custom scenarios). Get a little traction to the game system and give a stab at it, mate.

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