Managed to get some fights last week.

Against Burning Death Speed Freeks, won 2-1 in a close battle
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=27611

and against Tau (but without a report) I lost by 1-2 but was badly beaten.
Setup


The Warlock sneaks up for a good next turn support of 2 engagements.

Anyone else gaming with the Living Few?

Still think the Wraithguards is really powerful but so is a lot of stuff.
Against the Speed Freaks two units of Wraithguards almost killed a Warband and killed a Battlewagon mob in my first activations (tripple retained) but it was two units with a Vampire and a Stormserpent = 1150 points
In the second battle I had them mounted in Wave Serpents (650p) and the Tau player managed to keep them out of the battle with a unit of Hammerheads (350p)...

Nice battle reports! with Iyanden, your army is either slow or expensive I played a lot (actually now I play with Ulthwé, because of the not-so-complicated paint scheme ) with Iyanden, you have to protect what you have -with a lot of AA for example -against Thawks, Landas, etc -if the Wraihguard needs to take part in a CC is not soo good My main rule: if the WG arrived (by Webway, Vampire, Storm Serpent), they just walk 15cm -so they need to KILL that unit that they arrived for! So they need some preparation (with disrupt artillery it's easier, especially against orks!)

Using Stormserpent is a good idea ( at least 2), but with Iyanden it's too risky, and expensive. With a Vampire, it's 50p cheaper, and make sure, SS is the main target of every opponent (with Deathstrikes, Oddboyz, etc)! OR use Wave Serpents for 50p more! It's good when you have Warp Spiders, reinforced Guardians, etc..

But to stick to the topic: do you felt that 1+ init is too strong for them? I suggest to think the army list as a whole, not just for WG only! The list is expensive, over-activated, so they need this boost

Well the topic is Iyanden not just the +1 issue so it's nice to get som pointers on other things
The problem against the orks was that they deployed in a small area and was able to engage me with other formations when I had killed my targets...
In my opinion the Stormserpent has the ability to draw fire to it so that the other units might get away, my misstake was that I had too many units in the web (I think) Vampires is good but they can only deliver one unit. Waveserpents is also good but I (Currently) only own 6 of them so I can only mount one unit and they will be seeing a lot of fire. Usually stopping them from going too far.
Need to think of a way to spread the fire, perhaps a mix of the three transports
On the AA issue, how many Firestorms do you usually take? I usually take 1 unit of falcons (max 2) so in my build 2 firestorms is "normal". Sometimes I take fighters and titans for some more AA...
/uven

I play in a different style -I chose only 2 Spirit Hosts, and bulid my entire army to support them -it's a bit risky, but if it's works, it hurts

So maybe with a stronger air contingent, 2 Vampires to transport them, Phoenix bombers to act as CAP baits, and if i can afford, 2x5 SoV -with 1-2 Firestorms! I prefer Reinforced guardians in the webway, with Support Weapons -they are nice mid-close range firepower for the poor guardians, for only 50p! I also prefer to use Wraithguard for reinforce the guardians! They can take up a lot of shooting, and hold the middle (well, the space around the webway) of the board for 1-2 turns in good cover, and divide the opposing forces! If you're not sure of this tactic, take 2 units of reinforced guardians If you hold too much units in reserve, you will be badly over-activated though!

The Storm Serpen is also a fire magnet, but more expensive than the Vampire, and not as tough as you imagine first! You have to be very experienced to use it well, because it's fragile, and more than a primary target for your opponent Remember, they can hurt a ground unit more easily, than an aircraft (maybe an aircraft with planetfall -in this case, the Dragonship is the True Dream of an eldar commander! 8 BP in the first turn, maybe into the enemy's maybe crowded deployement zone! HUA ) You have to use the SS in the first turn, mainly because it will be dead for the second turn -so you have to go into the middle of the support fire capable enemy, as soon as possible, with your fragile, over activated units. For a tactic like this, it's better to use the less important reinforced guardian unit -if they survive this, you can call in the avatar next turn

Don't forget the cheap (well, 175p) Swooping Hawks, perfect teleporting unit -with an Exarch, for 200p, they can be a good support unit in an engagement (5x 4+ FF), for free or contest objectives at the 3rd turn!

The Nighstpinners, with their limited range disrupt weapons are also good against big blocks of infantry, especially against badly armoured orks! Remember, the orks have even morel imited range, they just can't match artillery! (only oddboyz/Supa Stompas, etc have a long range weapon!)

Try out the air heavy Iyanden list instead (orks don't have any real AA cover, just the cool Fightas, but you can easily hunt them down with your superior AA tanks), with a lot of support units!

I know it's a tough list -I tried it many times before -but against an AA heavy opponent, like IG, you will be in deep shit

Well my only objection against the Vampire is that if its used too much it becomes boring to play with. (same goes for thunderhawks etc.) As engagements is really deadly the game will be over in the first turn for the one who lost the fights if you go 2+ on the bloodsuckers. Sure you can do this from time to time but I find it more fun to limit the use of air assaults when I play.
The Reinforced Guardians is really good, when I play my Iyanden as Alaitoc or any other craftworld I usually tend to go with Wraithguards (and Support Weapons if I can afford) but when I play Iyanden I really want cheap activations so the Guardians tend to be "vanilla". Perhaps that is a mistake?
Waveserpents is also a good option but then you loose an activation later in the game when the Stormserpents/Vampires can roam around harassing the oponent

Do you have any good "all comers" army suggestion that is 0-1 Vampire?

You're totally right with air heavy Iyanden lists -they are for tournaments, not for friendly games Iyanden is totally not for friendly games -everyone hates Wraithguard, believe me

However in case of Iyanden, when your basic, "living few" units are expensive/ slow infantry units, you need the cheapest transport around -which is the Vampire!

Try it with Planetfall, Spacecraft also! It's a bit different than air assault

My main problem with Iyanden -> the list is not flexible enough -you have only 1-2-3 playable options (yeah, Spirit hosts in Vampires, in Wave Serpents, in Storm Serpents maybe -someone ever, ever tried to use them on foot? ), so very soon it will become boring for you and for your opponents also.. You have to buy at least 2 units of WG, for 700p, with the much needed transports, wraithseer - maybe well over 1/3 of your army! Every time.

..and painting yellow is much harder than painting black -try out Ulthwé instead, sorry I'm a huge fan of Iyanden, but the list has it's own drawbacks..

Reinforced guardians vs naked guardians -> who knows, sometimes it's good to have cheap units! But Guardians, without armour save, without ranged weapons, mainly in Wave Serpents are a different story, than Guardians in the Webway.

You have to chose their main role in your army -having too much units in the webway means you can only activate them in the 2nd/3rd turn, when they can only engage things close to them! With naked guardians, it's a bit risky -if someone get's that close to you, he's maybe tougher than you With reinforced guardians, you have to get them into the fray as soon as possible, to divide the opponents army with a big, and (because of the WG) resilent (eldar standard) unit. (as I play with them)

So, if you want a big unit to divide the opposing forces, get the reinforced ones, hide in cover, and activate them in the first turn, to take a good position.

With mounted guardians, it's a whole different story! You need mobile units to support an attack like that, etc

If you want cheap activation burner units, use rangers, swooping hawks, war walkers, maybe vyper jetbikes! Against orks, for example, snipers are always good

How about this?

Incompertus, 3000 POINTS
Iyanden Craftworld (NetEA Army Compendium v20120208)
==================================================

WRAITHGATE [50]

AVATAR [0]

SPIRIT WARRIOR WARHOST [750]
6 Wraithguards, Wraith Seer character, 6 Wave Serpents

SPIRIT WARRIOR WARHOST [350] (In Webb)
6 Wraithguards, Spirit Seer character

GUARDIAN WARHOST [250] (In Webb)
Farseer, 6 Guardians, 2 Wraithguard, Heavy Weapon Platform

GUARDIAN WARHOST [250] (In Webb)
Farseer, 6 Guardians, Heavy Weapon Platform, 2 Wraithguard

ASPECT WARRIOR TROUPE [200]
4 Swooping Hawk, Exarch

SWORDS OF VAUL TROUPE [250]
3 Falcon, 2 Fire Storm

SWORDS OF VAUL TROUPE [250]
3 Falcon, 2 Fire Storm

ENGINE OF VAUL TROUPE [250]
Storm Serpent

ENGINE OF VAUL TROUPE [250]
Storm Serpent

WAR WALKER TROUPE [150]
4 War Walker

Made some adjustments on the list and put up another battlereport. Didn't go that well...
Suggestions on a good solid build is more than welcome. (I do not own all models available and I tend to fancy using the ones I painted last so there are some limitations )

viewtopic.php?f=84&t=27722&p=527592#p527592

Next time I'll probably revert to using Vampires again or Revenant Titans or...

Were the Living Few special rule modified? As far as I remember, it restricts the army, to not have more "living" formation than spirit hosts.

I ask it beacuse it seems, the major restriciton and main cause of low-activation in Iyanden is this exact rule. I'm not expert of the Elda fluff, but I guess this rule is aimed to lessen the living stuff, and enforce large amount of spirit stuff, just as the Craftworld have it. On the technical side its just a major restriction (unlike any other Eldar list) and enforces players to take Spirit Warhost! In each and every other Eldar list (except Titan Clan, and some experimental ofc), you may fill out with cheap guardians and so keep the activation high, but not in Iyanden.

_________________
Epic Commander of the Prassium Invasion Troops 214th Regiment
***Action is our prayer. Victory is our offering.***

The rule is in the armylist in the beginning of this thread. I agree with your conclusion and even suggested the restriction to be tighter.

Ok,feels kind of lame to be stuck with an army and trying to get some development going when the AC is away from the board for a year or so...

I would like this army to take one of the following two roads:

1. No big change and go for approval
2. Let the knights in to the list and start some "development" before going for approval

My suggestions for small changes would be (repeating some of the previous posts).
Take away farsight from the Spirit/Wraithseer
Make the Wraithguards take up 2 spaces in the Vampire (Not sure if this is a typo or intended...)
Perhaps make "the living few" rule even harder. e.i. 1 wraith = 1 living

If we would let the knights in we would have to remake the list a little bit so it doesn't get to many goodies = take something away.
Also if we do this it would be fun to make the list a little more up to date with current fluff. Perhaps adding Wraithfighters, Wraithknights, anything else with wraith in the name , Bonesingers, Eldritch Raiders (or would that be a new army...?) or perhaps not add all of the above but at least consider them?

And give Uvenlord the place as an AC because he:

1. Actually owns an army for this.
2. Tries to activly help out with it's develoepment.
3. Is actuslly sctive on thid forum every week?

How long does it have to take before the ERC acts and takes away the AC-title from inactive players?? 3-5 years?? Do you giys wsnt the game to livebor not?

_________________
https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

Something really needs to be done about the Eldar lists. Spectrar Ghost isn't doing a very good job at all as army champion. He's made quite a few changes to the list, some rather unbalanced ones, and hasn't managed to get any of his modified versions of the lists approved.

I did a search in the battle reports section to see when Spectrar Ghost last posted up a battle report and can't find any battle reports from him at all. Surely that can't be right? Why would anyone bother becoming an army champion if they weren't going to play the list and game?? He hasn't posted on the forum in several months. Surely it's time for him to step down and let someone else more committed and active take on the role rather than things languishing further.


Bad idea. SG's Iyanden list is horribly unbalanced. I played Iyanden 4.1 in a game recently and kept apolagising to my opponent for how broken and inappropriately powerful the list was. I believe it is probably the most overpowered epic list there is.

I'll back this up with a comparison with the Epic-UK Iyanden list. Their Iyanden list is based on the Net-EA one and is mostly similar. It is extremely powerful and competitive – the online stats show Epic-UK Iyanden has been used in 42 games at Epic-UK tournaments and has won an impressive 52% of them.

The Net-EA Iyanden list is like the Epic-UK list on steroids, being better in several ways:
Cheaper Wraithguard (350 vs 375).
Higher initiative Wraithguard / Wraithlords with initiative 1+ rather than 2+.
Multiple cheaper formations (smaller War Walker formation, smaller aspect warrior formation) so that the disadvantage of low activation numbers can be avoided.
Much less restrictive living few limitation (Epic-UK has it so you total up the Wraithguard and Wraithlord formations and can't have more guardian, jetbike, aspect warrior and ranger formations combined that that).
Three troupes per host rather than the more restricted two in the Epic-UK list.
More powerful Phantom, Scorpion, ect.

The list really needs toning down and more restrictions. The limitation / theme is really weak too – it's easily possible to field a 3k army with only a single token Wraithguard formation and it's not Iyanden enough. There should be more wraith constructs in an Iyanden army – their background is that over 80% of the entire population of the craftworld were killed in the tyranid attack, a huge number, and their background says that all of the 80+% killed have since been turned into wraith constructs.


This is indicative of the existing list being overpowered and really not how things should be. Wraithguard are indeed an extremely powerful formation. There should be distinct disadvantages also in the list, that counteract having it and make the list still balanced and fun to play, which at the moment isn't really the case.

I would like to propose myself as Eldar army champion, I've been thinking about it for a while. I believe I would make a good candidate:

I'm on the forum a lot and active in discussion and playtesting.
I have a decent sized Eldar force at around 7-10k.
I have played in several EpicA tournaments in the UK and Australia, so have played many different opponents in competitive play.
I'm familiar with the Eldar background – ranging from the original background when they first appeared through to the current Eldar codex, Iyanden supplement, FW Eldar book, Valedor supplement, ect.
I regularly play online via Tabletop, so play people all across the world and we can freely play any armies without being constrained by models/army availability.
I champion the Black Templars list, which seems pretty balanced and hopefully will be approved once I find one more group to do 6 playtests.

I have ideas for what I would do, toning down SG's boosts/changes a bit but keeping the best of his ideas and Epic-UK's ideas. If accepted I would commit to getting 6 playtests up each for the main eldar lists (Biel-tann, Iyanden, Ulthwe, Saim-hann and Alaitoc) in my first year as army champion and would do my best to get these lists all approved as soon as possible.