[Bio-Titans] Regen and other... |
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ragnarok
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other...  Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 6:06 pm |
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For regen I will be happy with either 2 or 3. 1 at a push. Is 4 half of starting DC or remaining, because if it is half starting it isn't a bad idea.
attacks
I've always read it as 2. 1 just makes no sense.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:31 pm |
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It will take lots of playtesting to determine balance on this one. I would tend to lean towards #2.
d6 per point of damage/6 regens,
rolled in the end phase,
if the titan is still alive (so if you reduce it to 0DC during the turn, no resurrecton)
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Neal
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Markconz
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:36 pm |
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| Quote (nealhunt @ 01 Nov. 2005 (20:31)) | | It will take lots of playtesting to determine balance on this one. ?I would tend to lean towards #2. |
I'm going to be using no 2 (the 40k rule) extensively with my nids from now on, so is another local nid player. I'll let you all know how it goes.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:26 pm |
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As for 3 well it will get hard to survive when dropping to 2 or 1 DC. |
You know, though, now that you mention it, that sort of sticks with the concept of the Trygon rules from FW - the big beasties can shrug off tons of light hits at the beginning but as it takes damage it becomes harder for it to do so. It's sort of "death by a thousand cuts" in feel.
Hmmm... 40K parallel or FW parallel...
I can see positives and negatives to both.
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Neal
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ragnarok
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:43 pm |
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Nealhunt your not coming round to the regen= number of remaining DC are you? After you convince me that it was the wrong approach and I should agree with regen- number of hits taken.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:55 pm |
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Heh.
I'm not taking a strong position yet. I'm just saying it has a certain appeal.
Mechanically, #3 would be similar to the results of Void Shields where a few pot-shots wouldn't do much to slow it down but a concentrated effort to cripple it means it stays crippled.
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Thoreau 
"Do I contradict myself? Very well, then. I contradict myself." - Whitman
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Neal
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Markconz
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:09 am |
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If the the no. of DC remaining for regeneration (FW) idea is used, armies which find it difficult to kill titans (eg marines) will suffer from this even more. Small amounts of damage will heal very quickly.
Conversely armies which kill WE easily will still be able to kill bio-titans easiliy.
This is the complete opposite of the play balance issue we have been trying to achieve. For those that remember, the problem in playtesting so far with bio-titans which led to the regen idea (or similar ideas) was that Bio-titans need a boost against titan killing enemies, definitely not against armies which have little means to take them out. The 40k rule clearly works better than the FW rule from this perspective.
In summary, forget the very abstract fluff issues for a second and look at what these different rules do to game balance
Let me also add that FW rules are notorious for being unplaytested and unbalanced (see PG's blog for his frustration at their latest efforts). At least the 40k rule is playtested.
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ragnarok
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:35 am |
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Markconz- I think that it doean't matter which way we choose the number of D6 rlled armies like marines will suffer.
If the number is equal to the remaining number of DC then they will find it hard to initialy wound it.
If the number is equal to the nuber of DC lost then they will find it hard to remove the final few DC.
Also it the first example a WE has multiply chances of recovering only a few DC so extra 6s are lost. In the second example any extra 6s will result in move DC recoverd
Example a heirophant that has lost 1DC under the first example gets 5 chances to recover an single wound. Under the second it only has 1 chance. Now imagine the opposite. It is down to 1DC.
Under the first example it has one cahnce to recover 1DC, under the second it has can rcecover all 5 (5 6s on 5D6), not good for the marine player.
Thus overall the xD6 where x=remaining DC is best for those who find it hard to hurt a WE.
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Markconz
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:57 am |
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| Quote (ragnarok @ 01 Nov. 2005 (22:35)) | Markconz- I think that it doean't matter which way we choose the number of D6 rlled armies like marines will suffer.
If the number is equal to the remaining number of DC then they will find it hard to initialy wound it.
If the number is equal to the nuber of DC lost then they will find it hard to remove the final few DC.
Also it the first example a WE has multiply chances of recovering only a few DC so extra 6s are lost. ?In the second example any extra 6s will result in move DC recoverd
Example a heirophant that has lost 1DC under the first example gets 5 chances to recover an single wound. ?Under the second it only has 1 chance. ?Now imagine the opposite. ?It is down to 1DC.
Under the first example it has one cahnce to recover ?1DC, under the second it has can rcecover all 5 (5 6s on 5D6), not good for the marine player.
Thus overall the xD6 where x=remaining DC is best for those who find it hard to hurt a WE. |
You are missing the point I think. The toughness boost is needed against armies with TK and MW, the FW system doesn't provide this nearly as well as the 40k system.
FW system - if light damage is suffered it recovers quickly, if heavy damage is suffered it recovers very slowy. Scorpions, Shadowswords, etc will still have a field day.
40k system - whatever damage is suffered, it all recovers at a constant rate (though randomly). This makes it more possible to destroy the titan over several rounds, as marines are able to do.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: [Bio-Titans] Regen and other... Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 3:27 pm |
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Markconz: We seem to be working off different assumptions.
I had assumed that any regeneration would also come with a reduction in armor saves, as 3+RA is unworkable, imho. If the armor isn't changing, it won't matter anyway.
If it is reduced, that helps SMs far more than anything related to regeneration will inhibit them. That achieves the results you want, though the extent to which it is tempered will depend on the convention.
Conversely, WE-hunting forces won't benefit from the reduced armor because they are already using MW/TK, but they will definitely be impeded by the regeneration. Again, any regeneration system achieves your stated goals and only the extent of the effect is in question.
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Neal
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