Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 65 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

[OLD] Tyranid Army List v10.1

 Post subject: [OLD] Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:17 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 6097
Location: Worcester, MA
After 20 games and 3 months I was looking to do a small update (plus add some fluff to the rules and some pics for Mosc). Here's the change list:

Trygons

I've increased the Trygon Swarm to 225 pointsand removed of M and L options. Also, the Trygon upgrades for the swarm are now limited to 0-3.

The M swarms got to be pretty hard hitting in our games, so much so that I think they need to be capped at 6. A swarm of 6 will see a +75 point increase with this change which I think is warranted too.

Biovores and Exocrines

No changes to the S/M/L cost but I dropped the upgrades down to 25/50 points respectively to make the math easier and fit the cost structure closer. They haven't been out performing in any of our games so I'm not worried too much about this one, testing will confirm.

AA

AA on the Gargoyles has led to them rushing AC before they can disengage, which is something I'm not a fan of stylistically. I've removed their AA and gave the Zoanthrope an AA6+ shot at 30cm (like EpicUK). They both remain unchanged stat/point-wise aside from that, testing will show if they need Gargoyles need a bump in abilities or decrease in points, and Zoans a bump in points.

I also gave the Dom a 45cm AA5+, MW (akin to the Wyrd Boy Fist o Gork) just to try out.

I'm leaning more towards dropping the Meitoic Spores now from Onachus. Anyone object there?

Genestealers

I've made the Broodlord part of the core units and upped the cost to 175 for 6. This is just something I want to try out.


Attachments:
tyranids_v10.1.pdf [942.7 KiB]
Downloaded 810 times

_________________
Dave

Blog

Tournament Pack | Army List Compendium

Tyranids v10.2.1 | Knight World v.2.2


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:53 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5665
Location: Australia
Looking over the list i think that the list could me made easier to use by adopting 25 point margins.

Would anyone honestly take any of the 60 point upgrades?
Would there be any change in style and power in making 60 point upgrades 50 points?
Pricing 35 point items to 2 for 50 (?) or 3 for 75 and princig up the 20 point items to 25 i feel would be viable.

It just seems so micro-managed. Making a list should be easy and inviting, not a math test.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
World Eaters
Emperor's Children
Death Guard
Imperial Fists
Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:07 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:24 am
Posts: 4148
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Agreed.

Given the list's history with "difficult design" these odd-point costs just carry that on to some extent.

_________________
Space Marine Army Champion
Index Astartes - For all the Space Marine lists available
Space Marine Battle Reports


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:40 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:06 pm
Posts: 913
Location: Westborough, Massachusetts USA
Oh no, after taking a 60 point upgrade I only have 40pts! Whatever shall I do? Oh wait, I can purchase two gaunts of my choice for 40pts, and now it's a nice round 100points again! Hardly a math test.

By my count there's three units with "odd" points values: ravenors, dactylis, and trygons; not very overwhelming IMO. I can't speak to ravenors' 35pts because I haven't faced or used them, but do large AV's or small WE's warrant a points drop to 50? I think there'd be a lot of howling if they were only 50pts a piece.

_________________
Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:55 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 6097
Location: Worcester, MA
With non-25 points increments in 3 Ork lists, 2 Eldar lists and the Minvervans, BL, LatD and Necrons I don't think we're breaking new ground here. Adam's force selector is more than capable of doing the math for people if they feel they need it when adding the 20/35/60 upgrades.

_________________
Dave

Blog

Tournament Pack | Army List Compendium

Tyranids v10.2.1 | Knight World v.2.2




Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:27 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 7:20 pm
Posts: 4324
Location: London, UK
As an interested 'bystander', either have many 'odd' point breaks or none; what makes a list unpalatable is having just one or two. A classic case is Falcon upgrades in the Eldar list; the only 'odd' pointed unit that makes it hard to include sensibly.

And Dave is spot on with respect to the list calculator (or using your own version); that should not be a consideration give the amount of technology available.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:35 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5665
Location: Australia
Dave wrote:
With non-25 points increments in 3 Ork lists, 2 Eldar lists and the Minvervans, BL, LatD and Necrons I don't think we're breaking new ground here.

It's not about that, it is about keeping it simple.

Just because everyone in a group decides to do something, it does not make it right or lend weight to that view. All itr means is that you use it to micro manage the list.
Quote:
Adam's force selector


A great item to use however not really seen or known outside of taccom or EpicUK, and thank goodness that is not the only player base out there...

Beside all the unwarranted sarcasm that seems to come back with anything I post, I am just trying to help. The point system alone would sway me to play another list if I had a choice to play a game 'off the cuff'.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
World Eaters
Emperor's Children
Death Guard
Imperial Fists
Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:17 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 5553
It would have been nice for you to discuss the changes that affect my list with me first.

_________________
http://www.troublemakergames.co.uk/
Epic: Hive Development Thread


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:30 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid

Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:35 am
Posts: 3222
Perhaps you weren't replying to PMs? ;D

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:29 am 
Purestrain
Purestrain
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 4:17 am
Posts: 632
Location: Agri-World-NZ77
frogbear wrote:

...not really seen or known outside of taccom or EpicUK...



I beg to differ ;)

_________________
Uti Possidetis
May your beer be laid under an enchantment of surpassing excellence for seven years!
An online epic force creator:
Armyforge


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:41 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 3:15 pm
Posts: 1201
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
I think the changes are all sensible, except for Broodlords.

Given that Broodlords are a modelling project, making them mandatory might affect lots of Tyranid players. I have built two, but I would rather see it as a +25 points upgrade.

/Fredmans


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:58 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:15 am
Posts: 1588
Location: Oslo, Norway
The AA changes are a bit thoughtless, as I don't think they work that well with Leviathan (Gargoyles are common across both lists, Zoanthropes aren't).

Is there a modern beast that can be AA that is appropriate for Leviathan but not for Onachus?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:58 pm 
Hybrid
Hybrid
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:25 pm
Posts: 6097
Location: Worcester, MA
Fredmans, play it as a +25 upgrade if you like.

Ulrik, the spores maybe?

Frogbear, I'm not trying to be sarcastic I just don't see how the inclusion of those three upgrades makes a player have to micro-manage the list. They're optional, people don't have to use them. If they stick to the core formations everything is in increments of 25 points. How is it different than 10pt Rhino upgrades or 20pt lesser daemons?

On Armyforge, even it it's audience is solely comprised of members of this forum and the EpicUK (which I doubt) I don't think this army list has a much further reach. It's hosted on this forum, it follows that people using it are going to be aware of Armyforge.

_________________
Dave

Blog

Tournament Pack | Army List Compendium

Tyranids v10.2.1 | Knight World v.2.2




Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:46 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5665
Location: Australia
Dave wrote:
On Armyforge, even it it's audience is solely comprised of members of this forum and the EpicUK (which I doubt) I don't think this army list has a much further reach. It's hosted on this forum, it follows that people using it are going to be aware of Armyforge.

Many of the australian scene do not access taccom yet these lists are made available to them. They would not know much other than what a to gives them and even then, they want it printed out. An online generator is normally (unjustified probably) untrusted due to possible errors, a lack of official gw stamping, and a lack of knowledge of its background.

My view is that many people (including myself) trust our own calculations unless we have tested something thouroughly.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
World Eaters
Emperor's Children
Death Guard
Imperial Fists
Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tyranid Army List v10.1
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:57 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5665
Location: Australia
Dave wrote:
How is it different than 10pt Rhino upgrades or 20pt lesser daemons


I also have a problem with these so bad example. 25 points for 2 rhino and 25 points for daemons and/or 5 for 100 points are simple fixes.

Too often we refer back to lists from the JJ era that could really be looked at to simplify...

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
World Eaters
Emperor's Children
Death Guard
Imperial Fists
Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 65 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net