Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 128 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9

Command and Control for Nids

 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:54 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20886
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Ginger wrote:
zombocom wrote:
By far the majority are in favour of this change.

I am really not sure that this assertion is true. For example the many unhappy comments regarding the perceived impact on people's collections of metal bugs - - -

Consensus was certainly behind this change in the discussion thread, but I think a voting poll could quickly double-check.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:30 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:13 am
Posts: 8711
Location: Leipzig, Germany, Europe, Sol III, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster, Universe
Well id don't care that much about peoples collection in list designs. I myselfe have a huge collection of metal Tyranids. If i can't field anything in large numbers then eBay or count-as would solve :)

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:03 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:15 am
Posts: 1832
Location: Oslo, Norway
Not sure anymore which thread this should go in, but anyway. Had a rather wild idea when I was on my way home now, and thought I might as well throw it out:

Nids do not get bonus to initiative tests for Engage actions, but on a failed action test, a Tyranid formation must perform an Engage action rather than a Hold action.

What this represents: Two things. The first, is that if you fail a test with a controlled swarm, the Hive Mind is a bit confused and falls back on the standard tactic: throw bugs at the problem. If it's an uncontrolled swarm, it represents bugs without the familiar presence of the Hive Mind and hopped up on adrenaline (or the equivalent) lashing out against nearby enemies. This is plausible even for shooty bugs, as they would stay at firefight ranges.

Consequences: At first glance it makes it easier for Nids to Engage, but with 1+ init AND +2 to Engage like in some lists, it wasn't a problem before, was it? Now they at least have a chance to get an extra blast marker first. If there's a juicy target nearby, all is good for the Nids and they go munch on it. If there's not a juicy target in range, they get to do a move instead (but can't shoot or remove BMs like normal fms). However, if there's a dangerous target nearby they have to stay 15cm away (rather than the normal 5cm zoc) or risk an assault against a superior enemy (and they have at least one blast marker). In extreme cases they might even be forced into an assault if there's nowhere to go.

Pros: It's a very simple special rule. Combine with -3 init for uncontrolled swarm and it's instant Instinctive Behavior.

Cons: There's probably a bucketfull of consequences I haven't thought of, needs playtesting. Also, if you really, really don't like artillery bugs entering firefights on instinctive behavior it's a bad rule. I disagree with that, of course, I think shooty bugs instinctivly entering firefights is perfectly appropriate, but YMMV.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:13 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 5569
"engage on fail" was tried for both Blood Angels and World Eaters, and found to have far too many flaws.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:20 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5682
Location: Australia
zombocom wrote:
"engage on fail" was tried for both Blood Angels and World Eaters, and found to have far too many flaws.


For my part, I did not find it flawed as the BM was gained for the failed action as normal. It was people's perceptions and debate that saw this changed rather than taking into account the actual results of the rule used.

It was to gain acceptance that I conceeded to the updated Blood Rage rule, not because playtests showed it had "too many flaws". Just thought I would make that clear.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
Previous World Eaters
Previous Emperor's Children
Previous Death Guard
Previous Imperial Fists
Previous Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:34 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:15 am
Posts: 1832
Location: Oslo, Norway
zombocom wrote:
"engage on fail" was tried for both Blood Angels and World Eaters, and found to have far too many flaws.


Heh, should have known that somebody would have thought of that a long time ago.

Out of curiosity, what were the flaws?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:28 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA
Ulrik wrote:
Out of curiosity, what were the flaws?

It's effectively an automatic Engage action, regardless of Initiative roll. Once you are in Engage range, it's impossible to fail to Engage. It allows sure-fire combination actions, i.e. you can always successfully retain/Engage, regardless of Initiative value or mods. Assault-oriented Teleporters become impossible to fail with (as long as they have a chance to activate).

Also, an Engage action doesn't require the player to actually initiate an assault. If they just move away, then an assault never starts. That's arguably no different than choosing to move on a Hold action, but you can end up with odd effects like Infiltrator units taking a double move.

If the only concern were game balance, then most likely all of that could be dealt with via point costs, but the effects are "gamey" or generally undesirable to many people.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: Command and Control for Nids
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 5:54 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:15 am
Posts: 1832
Location: Oslo, Norway
The auto-pass doesn't really bother me (as they get a BM if they fail the test, not good if you're Enganging, and Nids have 0+ to engage in most lists anyway). The infiltrator move is a bit wonky, without that, Engage action without starting an assault is worse than a normal Hold. But can't really argue if most people find it too "gamey"...


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 128 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net