Tactical Command
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Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=176&t=31488
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Author:  malika2 [ Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

What do you guys think of the prow?

Author:  brother_bethor [ Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

I like it. The prow fits the Kill-ship fluff of an ancient design compared to "modern" starships.

Author:  jimmyzimms [ Fri Sep 15, 2017 2:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Not a fan of the prow

Author:  Doomkitten [ Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

jimmyzimms wrote:
Not a fan of the prow


Seconded. Doesn't look like the prow was even started to be honest. I definitely don't like the cheddar wedge look.

For an 'older' look, I'd have two smaller outboard sections with a body shaped like one hull of a catamaran - the front of the prow angled vertically rather than horizontally as in this. I'd like it to have a smaller surface area to the planet than the big wedge shape provides. Top/bottom being the smaller surfaces, rather than the sides.

Author:  SquatWarlord [ Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Does this ship need the atmospheric streamlining?
The prow looks too starwars for me. I like the aft part. (No jokes about being an aft man please)

What about a 2 part model with a disguised engine back that drops off when the ship is discovered. The engine then turns into a mine to slow down the pursuit.

That kind of prow looks like its intended to planetfall on a regular basis is this intended?
Wouldn't it be better to make it look like a passenger ship/shuttle or a cargo hauler as camouflage ?
007 the Russian fishing trawlers idea.

Would this be better off with a large sensor suite for scouting/recon?
Cheers

Author:  Thinking Stone [ Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

I actually quite like the prow. A vertical wedge might match the other ships in the range, but I'm not sure if I would like it so much.

Although the prow does seem a bit Star Wars-y compared with most other Gothic-y ships, I think it can fit in well with the existing range as a specialist ship.

I'm not really sure if questions of atmospheric streamlining or ground-exposed surface area from a background perspective are all that meaningful. Obviously, from a style perspective it's as valid an opinion as any other, but I don't think we need to force our current understanding of fluid mechanics onto a futuristic ship with unknown (made-up) physics behind it independently of style. Similarly for surface area, practically, I think it would make little difference unless we had a specific scenario and very specific information on what capabilities the enemy have.

So, basically, I don't think it necessarily needs 'real life' restrictions on the design. I think style restrictions are enough.

Author:  Doomkitten [ Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Thinking Stone wrote:
Similarly for surface area, practically, I think it would make little difference unless we had a specific scenario and very specific information on what capabilities the enemy have.

So, basically, I don't think it necessarily needs 'real life' restrictions on the design. I think style restrictions are enough.



Eh, sometimes it's nice to play thought experiments with this sort of thing. To me, it'd look better in that orientation, both aesthetically and also for the sake of rationalizing a made-up opinion on the technology of the far, far, far, far future.

Style-wise, it would look better and more coherent from a design PoV. However individuals reach that conclusion within themselves doesn't actually matter, and I'm not sure it's relevant to criticize how I reached my preference. Right now, the cheese wedge nose doesn't look like a good design to me, and it doesn't fit in *any* way to any other ship I've seen. Even if you want the nose primarily sloped horizontally there is still room for a sweeping back along the sides to other designs to keep it from being such an uninteresting, unfitting, flat, wedge-shape.


Tastes/butts/mileage/vary, etc.

Author:  malika2 [ Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

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And to give you a bit of context regarding the scale:
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Author:  Thinking Stone [ Tue Sep 26, 2017 8:28 am ]
Post subject:  Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Doomkitten wrote:
However individuals reach that conclusion within themselves doesn't actually matter, and I'm not sure it's relevant to criticize how I reached my preference.


I apologise that it seemed like I was criticising your person, @Doomkitten! I was not. I was merely suggesting that @malika2's designs need not be constrained by any 'real world' engineering (though it could be, if one wanted). Hence me saying a model, fantasy space ship's shape can be dictated entirely by 'style' rather than 'physics'.

However, if you were coming at it from a 'hard science' perspective, I think you'd need a more robust in-universe explanation for preferring a certain shape. That's just a comment on the feasibility of the physics, not about any person in particular.

As is obvious, we disagree on the shape, which is also fine in every way. I personally prefer the horizontal aspect, and don't feel so strongly about it (whereas I would feel strongly about dodgy hand-waving explanations :P).

(Edit: whilst looking at a fountain pen, perhaps that would be good inspiration?)

@malika2 The 'end cap' style of point on the latest iteration doesn't quite look right to me (I suppose maybe it reminds me of poorly-made weapon-butt sheathes, and so reduces the high-tech-y-ness?). But perhaps the original prow with less square segmentations like the second version would work?

I like the 'same height' extrusions of the original for that same 'tech-y' feel, too, whereas the more intruded look reminds me of WW2-inspired SciFi (like Star Wars gun heat exhaust grilles).

I do like the dome.

(In no way attempting to cause insult or injury, but merely musing!)
Thinking Stone

Author:  Doomkitten [ Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Thinking Stone wrote:
However, if you were coming at it from a 'hard science' perspective, I think you'd need a more robust in-universe explanation for preferring a certain shape.


I'm not sure where you got the idea I'm hard sciencing anything here. I'd be the last one to do that - I write stories, this is just another example of where the need to make up a story about something overrides anything else. It's a neat story, if anything it's "sci-fi-lite". I was mostly elaborating the point to ensure what's in my head was more fully conveyed. How the image got into my head is really an aside to the point of thinking I'd like it more if it had a different orientation. I'm a huge fan of the Space Fleet range of ships - they're (at least to me) a good example of how detailing can make the difference between horizontal and vertical orientation looking out of place and looking like a cohesive range. There's -some- detail in the model to make it fit, but purely IMO not enough. The prow is the biggest thing that doesn't fit, at least to me.

I appreciate that we can disagree and discuss. No personal stuff intended on my part either, hopefully none came across. To anyone.


Quote:
@malika2 The 'end cap' style of point on the latest iteration doesn't quite look right to me (I suppose maybe it reminds me of poorly-made weapon-butt sheathes, and so reduces the high-tech-y-ness?). But perhaps the original prow with less square segmentations like the second version would work?


A clean surface on one side looks good, but I think it needs to be married with details on the other. Perhaps sensor probes, domes, other details can be filled up on the underside with the top remaining smooth? It would yell out a more "high tech", specialist use rather than just loaded-to-the-gills warship, at least to me. To help casting and to squeeze finer details, perhaps it could be cast as a drop-on probe cluster similar to that used on the (frankly, excellent) DFC UCM cruiser plastics? I really, really think the prow just needs to be something other than a clean, flat wedge.

Author:  malika2 [ Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Some casts are in!

Boarding pods:
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Torpedoes:
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Javelin Fighters:
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Author:  malika2 [ Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

More stuff:

Sagaris Bombers:
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Mines:
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Author:  NoisyAssassin [ Sat Oct 07, 2017 6:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Oooh ordinance. I might need to repurpose some of those mines and boarding pods for my dark mech pocket40K project...

Author:  SpeakerToMachines [ Wed Nov 01, 2017 1:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Any news on the Apocalypse and Victory tanks?

Author:  malika2 [ Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Malika's workshop (models for Vanguard Miniatures)

Vanguard wasn't interested in them yet at this time since the expected market for these would be very small. Maybe we can convince them otherwise?

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