Hi!

I would delete the hip-shooting ability and just have a global -1 for firing on charge orders. Any attempt at having an ability that permits firing on charge orders would be overpowered.

Primarch

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Primarch


The Primarchload
Magnetized Titans Tutorial
Net Epic Gold
Heresy Rules

Hang on... we're at crossed purposes here. I don't want to see charging units firing. What I meant was that if you fire at a unit on charge, there is a -1 on your roll to hit (because they are moving quickly, this is the flip side of the coin to +1 to hit units on FF).

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In the games I've been playing, in Turn 1 units are essentially ordered as they are revealed, on an activation by activation basis. I'm giving serious consideration to playtesting a system where the orders phase is dispensed with in favour of ordering units as they are activated.

If and when I playtest this, I'm going to throw in the -1 to hit roll modifier when firing at units on Charge orders.

Thoughts?

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Taking a page from E:A? That would be a radical change, but I like the idea. It would give players more tactical flexibility. Let us know how it turns out. I'm looking forward to your results.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

Hi!

Bissler, it seems slowly but surely your inching towards the Heresy model I designed.

I agree with the change and believe the change will produce more decision making as the battle ebbs and flows.

Primarch

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Primarch


The Primarchload
Magnetized Titans Tutorial
Net Epic Gold
Heresy Rules

Totally agree. That's one of the things I like about E:A - units aren't locked in to specific orders, which gives you the ability to react to unfortunate events and unexpected opportunities.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of issuing orders in the first place? Isn't the whole point to make players think ahead and actually use some strategy? How is this different from any other regular alternating activation system like Warmachine where you pick a unit and decide what action they take, then I do the same and so on?

One of the things that appealed to me about 2nd ed Space Marine all those years ago and that set it apart from other wargames was that you were a general commanding a huge army, you weren't supposed to be down in the trenches making split second decisions, you were in the war room planning the overall strategy and then observing the results.

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Thanks,
Troy


Once Upon a Midnight Dreary....

Yip! The Evolution ruleset was something I came up with as a result of playing E:A. I thought the more dynamic activation-based play was a great aspect of an otherwise hateful ruleset. So basically I've nicked that and applied that to the system that we all know and love!



I apologise for my wording of my suggestion, it made it sound like I was designing another system altogether, what I actually meant was that I'd try this idea out on the Evolution ruleset. I still can't persuade my opponent to play an entirely new system otherwise Heresy would be the way to go!



You are absolutely correct FL. It's because I generally feel the same as you that I've been reluctant to implement this change. However, because of the way that turn one goes (in play testing Evolution) it feels right to try this across the system. It wouldn't mean you would have to play it this way however, in play testing turn two onwards has been using the traditional method of ordering units. What I'm saying is that I'm happy for people to play it either way.

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Ordering as units are they are activated has been a success! What we've found is that the play is much more reactive to the battle as it evolves throughout the turn, and that this means the game is being played in perhaps a more realistic way.

For example, under the old system, if you had a unit on advance and another unit attacked it before it had even had the chance to move, the turn was effectively over for the unit being attacked. It could not defend itself due to being on Advance orders. Now, if a unit was attacked, and. It hadn't been activated yet, it can react to the situation and place a First Fire counter to try and kill its attackers just before Close Combat is resolved. On the other hand, if the unit being attacked has already been activated and on Advance orders, it will still not be able to defend itself, but at least it has had the chance to have moved and fired.

I dunno if this makes sense, hope so! The long and short of it is that ordering on the go further deepens tactical play during the game.

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Another follow-up point from play testing:

It used to be the case that I had the army cards for all of my forces and could easily keep track of when units were reaching their break points. I do still have the cards but no longer use them as changes in points values is misleading. This means that keeping track of when units break is a bit of a nightmare as I'm constantly refereeing to PDFs or bits of paper. Because this is such a pain, I've taken to checking the break points in the End Phase when they are being checked for VPs anyway.

This means that Morale Checks are carried out in the End Phase and any fails mean that a Fall Back action must be taken. A second roll, this time to rally the unit, is then performed there and then. If this is passed, the unit may be ordered as normal in the next turn, but if it is failed, the unit has routed, and all models should be removed.

This has the effect of simplifying the morale rules and speeding up play.

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I've spent the entire day reviewing the Net Epic Evolution rules and have made several changes. Hopefully these changes will improve the system.

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to read anything about this project, I was bowled over when I realised about 100 people had downloaded my rules. If you are one of the 100 people who downloaded the rules, please don't hesitate to contact me if you have any questions you want to raise about the system.

I've attached the updated documents below but please note that they are also updated in the 1st posting on this thread as well.

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For anyone who missed it, the Net Epic Evolution rules were used in my recent video battle report. Hopefully this will help shed some light on the major changes to play:

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It's occurred to me that if there are people who would prefer using the order dice to the old order counters this would work for Net Epic Evolution. As you order as you go, the order dice could be placed next to your formations. I'd suggest that you only require the target result to represent First Fire orders. But for players who want to monitor all of the formations, the triple arrows could represent charge orders, while the four radiating arrows represent advance. The lightning within the cog could be used by skimmers which have First Fire orders and performed pop-up attacks (they are not subject to the same penalties for incoming fire so some players I may find it preferable to distinguish between the two).

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I prefer using order counters for NetEpic.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

That's fair enough DS, I do too! As a matter of fact, I just received delivery of another batch of the old counters yesterday!

It's just because I've seen some criticism of the old counters that it occurred to me that because of Evolution's order as you activate system that the order dice could be used in place of the counters for those who would prefer to do so.

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