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Welcome to the Polyversal Board

 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:48 pm 
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Good news!


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:12 pm 
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Good to hear Tertius.

I'm sure everyone would appreciate any little previews you could toss our way - even just very basic stuff that hopefully won't change now considering how long you've been at it.

Comforting to know that you will be able to capture the essence of some of armies like Eldar and Robotech. I mean that is the real beauty of 6mm isn't it?

-Tim


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 2:21 am 
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Thats really good news. You know us specialty gamers, always clamoring for me :)

The biggest problem I have with the secrecy, other than I feel like a kid waiting for Santa at Christmas, is...maybe I _shouldnt_ be waiting. I know nothing about the game. I dont know if it borrows every rule from FWC that I hate and just recycles it, or keeps the same clunky to-hit process from Strike Legion...

When you can, if you could post veiled hints about the style of game it is...I, for one, would be very grateful!

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:30 am 
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Kealios: I'm not sure what exactly you want to know. Ask away. I will answer what I can. It does not use the FWC/ Warmaster press-your-luck command mechanic.

I have read Strike Legion, but never played it. This is not Stike Legion.

You mention the to-hit process. Here's how it works.
The attacking model rolls three dice:
The model's targeting die (d4-d12, depending on the quality of the targeting system).
The firing weapon's AT, AP, or AA die (depending on target, vehicle, aircraft, or infantry).
The unit's current Combat Effectiveness die (changes with stress, etc.).
The dice are color-coded and easily picked out with a glance at the Combatant Tile.

If the total of the three dice exceed the target's Profile stat, it is a hit.
Damage is determined with the same roll result. Do not roll again.
Weapons have a Low, Medium 1, Medium 2, or High damage stat.

Low damage is the lowest of the individual dice rolls.
High is the highest.
Mediums 1 & 2 use the middle. If there are only two separate numbers (5,5,3 for example), the medium one uses the single, and medium two uses the two added together.
If all three are the same, add them.
Examples: 2, 5, 7
Low: 2
Medium 1: 5
Medium 2: 5
High: 7

3,3,8
Low: 6
Medium 1: 8
Medium 2: 6
High: 8

4,4,4
Low-High: 12

Each unit has a damage track on its card, with results 1-12. Compare the damage with the chart. Could be a kill, weapon destroyed, immobilized, harmless armor hit, damage to various systems, etc. the larger and more exotic the target, the more possibilities. It's a bit to get your head around for the first few rolls, but players quickly pick it up, especially with the color-coded dice and combatant tiles.

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:23 am 
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Is it IGOUGO or alternating activation? How many models/stands is it designed to be played with per side? Seems like a lot of math for an army scale game like Epic.

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:46 pm 
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It's truly not hard, or much math. It's just a bit to pick up at first, because it is different. At cons, I teach people in minutes, and within a turn they are playing on auto-pilot with no slowdown, including new gamers and kids.

Acitvation is alternating, and variable. Units are organized into commands. Each commander gets an initiative roll, and gets to activate a number of units within his command. You may get just pne, you may get a lot, it is bbased on the difference between the opposing commanders's rolls. I roll 4, you roll 6, You activate two. Them we roll again. Repeat until all units in command range are activated, then alternate out of command units.

As for size, it's really up to how much you want to play.
We're still testing, but I think it's best with 3-6 command structures. Each command adds more time, simply because it is more to move. 3 is probably best, for a 2-hour game with maneuvre, etc. 6 is a lot of stuff on the table, and awesome, but necessarily slower.

One command structure is typically one command unit and up to six units.
Units can be a single titan-sized vehicle, down to a tank platoon, or a mechanized infantry squad of 6-10 stands and their apcs.

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 5:33 pm 
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Activation sounds very interesting. I like that command can give you a very significant benefit, but by the end of the round even if you have terrible luck/command you still get to go with all your units.

I like the sound of the dice mechanic to hit/damage. One roll to do it all, but is still sensible.

On the attack roll front, how is that executed? If you activate one platoon at a time, does each element in that platoon make an individual attack roll at an individual enemy element? Or do you make one attack for the whole platoon?

Sounds like army list building will be fun, as you will have to figure out a command structure and not just what platoons you want to take.

-Tim


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:57 pm 
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All sounding interesting so far.

How are you planning to release army lists ? I guess there will be lists for all the manufacturers who are in partnership and I know there will be unit generation rules.

You have mentioned other "proxy" lists to cover other armies people may own. I only ask because of my playgroup's reluctance to play anything "unbalanced" or "beta." I like to tinker with rules (i see it as the main reason i play table top and not for example computer games) but others just won't play unless there is something "official" and play tested... :{[]

I can see their point, as if you spend 2-3 hours on a game on your one free evening of the week and the out come is decided that one player was bound to win from the start then it is frustrating. I guess i'm a good looser :D


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:39 pm 
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Thanks for the preview.

This basically confirms my fears: this is a smaller-scale game rather than a grandiose one. The reason for this is the same reason I feel Strike Legion is also a smaller game: the shooting mechanic is individual with no way to speed it up.

In Epic, you can have a unit of 10 tanks. This group of tanks has 2 attacks per vehicle, so you can roll 20 dice in one go, allocating hits front-to-back in a lightning-quick manner. SL, and it looks like Polyversal, would have you roll each tank one at a time, and if any vehicle somehow had multiple attacks, you would need to resolve each attack before moving on to the next.

I liken this to Battletech: it's a great skirmish game, with each attack from each Mech being rolled and tracked separately, then allocated separately as well, but throw in more than 4 mechs per side and now you have a nightmare on your hands.

Its ok - I'll still likely pick it up...I just keep hoping for something Epic-like but with customizable units.

:whistle

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:56 pm 
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Kealios wrote:

In Epic, you can have a unit of 10 tanks. This group of tanks has 2 attacks per vehicle, so you can roll 20 dice in one go, allocating hits front-to-back in a lightning-quick manner. SL, and it looks like Polyversal, would have you roll each tank one at a time, and if any vehicle somehow had multiple attacks, you would need to resolve each attack before moving on to the next.
:whistle


Tertius wrote:
One command structure is typically one command unit and up to six units.
Units can be a single titan-sized vehicle, down to a tank platoon, or a mechanized infantry squad of 6-10 stands and their apcs.


Looks like you're wrong. A "unit" is a tank platoon or a mech. infantry company.


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:37 am 
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Kealios: it is not as granular as Battletech. I agree that BT bogs down and feels more like a small skrimish than a sweeping battle. It is true that each shot is resolved by a roll, but it is just one roll. It moves quickly. If you miss, you move on. If you hit, you figure damage quickly. Most smaller things die or not. There isn't much to track. I agree you can't merge 20 shots into one big roll, and I have thought about making an optional way to do it, but I doubt I will, for now.

Units are like the size of the ones in Space Marine. 1 superheavy, 3-5 regular vehicles, 6-10 infantry, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:45 am 
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Blip wrote:
All sounding interesting so far.

How are you planning to release army lists ? I guess there will be lists for all the manufacturers who are in partnership and I know there will be unit generation rules.

You have mentioned other "proxy" lists to cover other armies people may own. I only ask because of my playgroup's reluctance to play anything "unbalanced" or "beta." I like to tinker with rules (i see it as the main reason i play table top and not for example computer games) but others just won't play unless there is something "official" and play tested... :{[]

I can see their point, as if you spend 2-3 hours on a game on your one free evening of the week and the out come is decided that one player was bound to win from the start then it is frustrating. I guess i'm a good looser :D



Well, this has been the subject of a lot of discussion. I am not sure where it will end up, frankly. There are no, "army lists," per se. The game is intended not to limit you. You can stat out your own units based on what models you have. We are working on a points system, which is not an easy task.

If you want 3-tank units, you can do it. If your force is based on units of 4, fine. If you want all mechs, fine. My armies are made up of minis from every source you can imagine. I have one with rough riders, jump infantry, heavy gear mechs, modern microarmor, repainted mechwarrior dark age mechs, and flyers from three different companies. You can customize units with bolt-on tech, and one of five psychological profiles, which affect their performance on the table.

We plan to make combatant tiles for what comes in the box, and I hope to make more "official" interpretations of units from our partners. This is still up in the air.

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:32 am 
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Hi!

I'm always on the lookout for 6mm rule-sets. Your use of polyhedral sorta reminded me of a variant of DS 2 that used dice instead of chits.

Give us the heads up when you need playtesters or a kickstarter is ready to go.

Primarch


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:08 pm 
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Kealios wrote:

In Epic, you can have a unit of 10 tanks. This group of tanks has 2 attacks per vehicle, so you can roll 20 dice in one go, allocating hits front-to-back in a lightning-quick manner. SL, and it looks like Polyversal, would have you roll each tank one at a time, and if any vehicle somehow had multiple attacks, you would need to resolve each attack before moving on to the next.


Now, I haven't played epic in quite a while, but that seems to me to be a bit of an extreme example. That's like a whole Leman Russ company is it not? And unless weapons are identical you'd have to roll separately or use different coloured dice - and then there is a save to be made on the opponent's side right?

I recall in my marine vs. eldar matches, that we often had like 4 to 6 tanks per activation that shot all at once - with armour save. Compared to polyversal in that scenario the number of die rolls is not *that* much more.

I know one of the games I play, Squadron Strike (a space game), has a "roll one set of dice" per attack thing too - BUT they also provided a method to resolve a large number of attacks when things go carried away (say like when your squad of 12 fighters each unloads with 4 attacks piece - rolling 48 times is painful). It basically then distilled down the attacks to resolving as per the average probabilities with a die roll in there to give a small random variation.

So I think after polyversal is all tested and ready to go, you could look at having some sort of optional chart/method that could be used to speed up the resolution of a large number of attacks that gives pretty close to average results. Definiately a bit more complex that Squadron Strike, as you have 3 different dice you are rolling instead of 1 accuracy die, but I'm sure something can be done that will not mess with the way it was designed to be played.

-Tim


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 Post subject: Re: Welcome to the Polyversal Board
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:21 pm 
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A Leman Russ company actually shoots 30 times at full strength, if I recall, and since it is a staple in most IG armies, shouldnt really be considered an extreme example :P

As for rolling dfferent colored dice, yea: "The blue are the AT3, the red is AT4"...and then you pass the hits over to the opponent who rolls them for his saves. As any veteran of any ruleset can tell you, once you know the system it can be quite fast to resolve anything...but some rulesets are more streamlined to begin with than others.

ANyway, not trying to be a downer. Really looking forward to seeing these rules...

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